Author Topic: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows  (Read 107513 times)

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1170 on: August 15, 2023, 02:18:00 PM »
Wrapping up the subtitles and the closed captioning for the unscripted material that replaced never shot Scenes 25 through 27:

After Tracy and Quentin enter the vestibule, Quentin puts his suitcase down, embraces Tracy, who comes over to him, and asks -


- as does the closed captioning -


- and as the subtitles show, Quentin then says -


- and the closed captioning reflects the same -


- and the closed captioning also reflects that Tracy laughs -


- though the subtitles do not acknowledge that.

End of sequence....

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1171 on: August 15, 2023, 05:32:00 PM »
Revisiting how Scene 28 is scripted:

...

28     INT - FOYER - DAY                                 28

       as Quentin carries Tracy in he gives her a big
       kiss.  HOLD FOR A MOMENT and then Carlotta
       interrupts them from O.S.


And that's when the first part of Monday's quote -

Page 8/Scene 28 - Carlotta (O.S.): 'Mr. & Mrs. Collins?'

- comes up, followed by the script continuing with:

       Quentin and Tracy are momentarily embarrassed,
       caught unawares.

       CARLOTTA - CLOSE-UP

       She is smiling and friendly.


And that's when the second part of Monday's quote -

Page 8/Scene 28 - Carlotta: 'I'm Carlotta Drake, Welcome to Collinwood.'

- comes up, followed by the script continuing with:



28     CONTD                                    CONTD    28

       BACK TO SCENE

       as Quentin puts Tracy down.

                             QUENTIN
                 Thank you, Miss Drake.

                             CARLOTTA
                 Carlotta, please.

       She is looking them over carefully, in female
       fashion.  Tracy offers her hand.

                             TRACY
                 Hello, Carlotta.

                             CARLOTTA
                      (taking her hand)
                 It's so good to have you here --
                 I do hope you'll find everything
                 to your liking, Mrs. Collins.


End of scene.

...

... after Carlotta greets them from off screen, once she comes on screen, she switches things up by actually saying "Welcome to Collinwood. I'm Carlotta Drake" (and Grayson made some notations in her script to be "pleasant and straight" and "almost preoccupied with looking at him + her) - and while Quentin responds to Carlotta as scripted, Carlotta's line to address her by her first name is dropped - and rather than "Hello, Carlotta", Tracy says "How do you do" - and Carlotta's greeting to Tracy and her hope that everything will be to Tracy's liking is also dropped. (And I'm surprised that Grayson didn't make a notation about Carlotta saying it's so good to have Tracy at Collinwood because as we'll definitely find out along the way, clearly that's not how she feels because she has a definite agenda in mind, so chances are the line would have been delivered with that subtext in Carlotta's mind.)

...

... and it's interesting to note that DC's script has an added notation that the camera was supposed to pan to a 2 shot of Carlotta and Tracy when Tracy greats her and Carlotta is so nice to her, but given the way the scene actually plays in the film, apparently that idea was also dropped because what actually happens is, in camerawork that's unscripted, Scene 28 dissolves into the start of the upcoming Scene 29...

 [nods]

Offline Annie

  • DSF God
  • *****
  • Posts: 2756
  • Karma: +1059/-6065
  • Gender: Female
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1172 on: August 15, 2023, 07:25:10 PM »
Wow !!!!! Amazing such good memories I sure do miss the show a lot .
Anne
"Never Give Up On Your Dreams "I Didn't So Don't
You"    By Barry Manilow

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1173 on: August 16, 2023, 01:04:06 AM »
When it comes to the differences in the subtitles and the closed captioning and one bit of dialogue for Scene 28:

Carlotta greets Quentin and Tracy off screen with "Mr. and Mrs. Collins" - and then once she comes on screen, she adds "Welcome to Collinwood. I'm Carlotta Drake" - and the subtitles reflect all that exactly - but as we know the closed captioning often has a strange aversion to contractions so it has -


- and after Carlotta goes over to them, as she shakes Quentin's hand, he says "Thank you, Miss Drake" - and the subtitles also reflect that - but the closed captioning only has -


- not to mention the closed captioning jumps the gun and has Quentin's line on and off screen before he even says it - and similarly the closed captioning displays Tracy's reworked "How do you do" -


- before she says it and shakes Carlotta's hand - though the subtitles get things right by having it be on screen as -


- the end of Scene 28 crossfades into the beginning of Scene 29.

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1174 on: August 16, 2023, 02:26:10 PM »
... the original slideshow featured this line of dropped dialogue:


NoDS: Scene #28 - Carlotta: 'It's so good to have you here. I
do hope you'll find everything to your liking, Mrs. Collins.'

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1175 on: August 16, 2023, 07:00:24 PM »
Revisiting a couple related posts associated with Scene 28:

...

And as usual, here's a much better version of the photo -


(Click here for a 700X540 version)

And one of the many copies of that still that popped up in magazines had this caption:

"You will really enjoy seeing lots of your favorite daytime TV stars in the
full length feature film, Night Of Dark Shadows. It will be released soon."

Of course, "full length feature film" is just another way of saying theatrical film. But given how much was cut from NoDS, "full length feature film" definitely stings because who knows if we'll ever see NoDS at its full length...

...

It's a amazing how unobservant one can be for over 50 years. I didn't realize until today that 1) in the above still in reply #772 Tracy and Quentin are entering the foyer, not the vestibule, as they do in the film, and 2) they're each carrying double the suitcases than they actually do in the film when they enter the house -


- because they've left some suitcases (and art supplies) behind the car -


But then, as I've pointed out before, this still (which I'd completely forgotten I had back when I was dealing with the Lobby Cards versions) of Carlotta greeting the couple is quite obviously also taken in the foyer -


(Click here for a 700X476 version)

- and as I've also pointed out before, Scene 28 was actually scripted to take place in the foyer -

...

...

28     INT - FOYER - DAY                                 28

       ...


 - but apparently for whatever reason DC decided to shoot it in the vestibule - but not knowing that beforehand, the still photographer took his photos where they thought the scene would be shot...

...

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1176 on: August 17, 2023, 12:52:04 AM »
Revisiting how Scene 29 is scripted:

...

29     INT - DRAWING ROOM - DAY                          29

       A Carlotta-led tour is in progress.  Tracy stands
       at the piano, toying with the keyboard, as Quentin
       examines a piece of sculpture with a professionally-
       amused eye.  Carlotta is holding forth.


And that's when Tuesday's quote -

Page 9/Scene 29 - Carlotta: 'Mrs. Stoddard, before her death, served tea here every afternoon.'

- comes up, followed by Wednesday's quote -

Page 9/Scene 29 - Quentin: 'I'm afraid that's one tradition we won't keep.'

- coming up, followed by Thursday's quote -

Page 9/Scene 29 - Tracy (trying out one of the sofas): 'Oh, no! We can't let the house down. Why don't we call Claire and Alex. Tea in the drawing room with the lord of the manor.'

- coming up, followed by Friday's quote -

Page 9/Scene 29 - Quentin (to Carlotta): 'Oh, did you tell the Jenkins' we'd be here today?'

- coming up, followed by the script continuing with:



29     CONTD                                    CONTD    29

And that's when yesterday's quote -

Page 10/Scene 29 - Carlotta: 'I didn't know you would wish it.'

 - comes up.

End of scene.

And so far there are still no differences between the way DC's and Grayson Hall's scripts are written - and while there are no notations worthy of mention in DC's script, Grayson's has something that will be mentioned below.

... and as alluded to above, at the point that Quentin begins to play the piano Grayson writes in her script "Q is playing chords on the piano. Moment of my recognition" (which certainly seems to point out that Grayson was aware when she made the notation that the sequence of Carlotta watching Quentin and Tracy's arrival and reacting to seeing Quentin's face was not going to be shot) ...

...

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1177 on: August 17, 2023, 08:20:12 PM »
When it comes to Scene 29, for the most part the subtitles get everything right - on the other hand, the closed captioning doesn't:

Scene 29 begins in the Drawing Room with Carlotta walking over to Tracy as she says "Mrs. Stoddard, before her death, had tea served here every afternoon" - and to that Quentin remarks "That's one tradition we won't keep" - and both the subtitles and the closed captioning get all that correct - however,  the closed captioning also indicates that Quentin -


- and after that Tracy speaks up and says "Oh, no. We can't let the house down" - and the subtitles get that correct - however, the closed captioning has -


- with the "Oh, no" missing - and it isn't until after Tracy says that that the subtitles indicate -


- and then Tracy completes her point by saying "We can call Claire and Alex and invite them for tea in the drawing room with the lord of the manner" - and the subtitles get all that correct - but the closed captioning has -



- dropping the "in the drawing room" but they do go on to say "with the lord of the manor."

More to come....

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1178 on: August 18, 2023, 03:12:40 PM »
A still to revisit that pertains to Scene 29:

...

...

And a better version of the still:


(Click here for a 700X540 version)

...

And the only places I can recall it being officially published is in John Willis' Sceen World Volume 22 (which features all the films of 1971) and on page 23 of the Movie Soundtracks' booklet. Neither has a caption worth sharing because all both do is identify the actors...

...

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1179 on: August 18, 2023, 08:02:12 PM »
Continuing with the subtitles and the closed captioning for Scene 29:

When it comes to Quentin's scripted line asking Carlotta if she'd told the Jenkins they would be arriving, that line is actually given to Tracy in the film - and both the subtitles and the closed captioning get that right -





- and when Carlotta doesn't reply because her attention is deeply fixated on what Quentin is doing at the piano, both the subtitles and closed captioning reflect that Tracy delivers an unscripted -





- and speaking of Carlotta's fixation with what Quentin is doing at the piano, at the point that Quentin begins to play Grayson writes in her script "Q is playing chords on the piano. Moment of my recognition" (which certainly seems to point out that Grayson was aware when she made the notation that Scenes 25 through 27 dealing with Carlotta's reaction to seeing Quentin's face were not going to be shot).

More to come....

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1180 on: August 19, 2023, 02:44:10 PM »
Wrapping up the subtitles and the closed captioning for Scene 29:

After Tracy's second question to Carlotta finally breaks through Carlotta's fixation on what Quentin is doing at the piano and Carlotta answers with a reworked "No. I'm sorry. I didn't know that's what you wanted," Carlotta then delivers an unscripted "Come, let me show you the rest of the house." - but the closed captioning has -


- as does the subtitles -


- which also jumps up to Tracy's unscripted response - and the closed captioning acknowledges the same response -


- after which Carlotta moves to leave the room with Tracy following and Quentin gets up from the piano to also follow.

End of scene....

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1181 on: August 20, 2023, 03:34:00 PM »
Before we move on to the subtitles and closed captioning for Scene 30 I want to get into something regarding the Blu-ray/DVD and VHS/Laser versions of the film that may only be an issue that I not only find interesting but also puzzling. Specifically, it's something about the transfers. Over the course of working to get screen captures and videos of the film I've noticed that whereas, unless there's an actual crossfade transition from one scene to another, as there is from Scene 28 to Scene 29, that's supposed to be apparent because it's seen by the audience, when it comes to the Blu-ray/DVD transfers most scenes lead directly from one scene to the next without any sort of transition effect, but that's not quite the case with the VHS/Laser transfers. When it comes to the VHS/Laser, regardless of whether there's a transition effect between scenes, there's seemingly always at least one frame that contains aspects of each scene.

Here are two videos I've created for the change from Scene 29 to Scene 30 that probably show what I'm getting at better than I can explain it (I've slowed down the individual frames so that each displays for 2 seconds rather than the 33/1000th of a second they normally display at):

Blu-ray:


Laser:


Like I said, it's puzzling to me why the VHS/Laser transfers seemingly created an intermediate frame between scenes that the Blu-ray/DVD transfers don't have. Shouldn't all scene changes of a film play the same and true to the actual film regardless of what video format the film was transferred to? Apparently not. At least not in the case of NoDS (and probably also hoDS - I haven't checked it).

Maybe if Darren Gross sees this post one day he'll be able to explain why there's a difference. Or if anyone reading this now knows why, please feel free to tell us because I would more than welcome an explanation.

And to go off on a tangent from the main point of this post, you've no doubt noted that I've brought up the Laser disc version of NoDS and shared frames from it. Well, that's because I've always wanted to own a copy of the Laser discs of the films and several months back I saw a nice deal on a never opened copy, so I bought it. But not owning a Laser disc player, that meant that I needed to find one that 1) wasn't strictly Japanese, which is the case with way too many available for sale online (Japanese players are 100V AC and would fry if used in the US because we have 120V AC) and 2) didn't cost a ridiculous and astronomical amount of money (just because good Laser disc players aren't readily available, that's no excuse to milk the public for all they're worth! - I'm talking to you, way too many eBay sellers!!). Luckily a few months ago I found one that got glowing reviews back in the heyday of laser discs and didn't cost an arm and a leg, so I bought it, and I'm more than satisfied with it.

And that all leads to how I'd always heard that the Laser disc transfers of the films are so much sharper than the VHS transfers. And I've discovered that's very true, as you can see in this side-by-side comparison of part of a frame from NoDS Scene 30:


Laser         VHS

And considering my VHS copy of NoDS is starting to show wear, I'm more than happy to not only have another copy of that version of the film, but one that's sharper than the VHS...

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1182 on: August 21, 2023, 02:28:14 PM »
Revisiting how Scenes 30 through 32 are scripted:

...

30     INT - FIRST FLOOR CORRIDOR - DAY - WIDE ANGLE     30

       Shooting through Dining Room doors with the table
       and center piece in F.G., the three of them walk
       TOWARD CAMERA.


...

...

31     INT - FIRST FLOOR STAIRWAY - DAY                  31

       ANGLE from second floor landing as they climb the
       stairs TOWARD CAMERA.


And that's when Sunday's quote -

Page 10/Scene 31 - Carlotta: 'As a child I used to hide here. They had so many parties then. All the guests...were so elegantly dressed and the candles were always burning.'

- comes up, followed by Monday's quote -

Page 10/Scene 31 - Tracy: 'You lived here as a child?'

- coming up, followed by Tuesday's quote -

Page 10/Scene 31 - Carlotta: 'My mother was the housekeeper.'

- coming up, followed by the script shifting to Scene 32:

32     PAN WITH THEM as they reach the second floor and  32
       walk by CAMERA heading for the Gallery.  As they
       pass the steps leading to the third floor, Quentin
       stops.

       GROUP - HIGH ANGLE

                             QUENTIN
                 What's up there?

                             CARLOTTA
                 Nothing you would want to see now.


And that's when Wednesday's quote -

Page 10/Scene 32 - Quentin: 'Is that the tower I saw from the outside?'

- comes up, followed by today's quote -

Page 10/Scene 32 - Carlotta: 'Yes. It's used for storage now.'

- coming up, followed by the script continuing with:

       They start walking again as Quentin hesitates for
       a moment longer, still looking up the stairs
       TOWARD CAMERA.




32     CONTD                                     CONTD   32

       Finally, he turns away and EXITS THE SHOT.

       HOLD on empty corridor as their VOICES and
       FOOTSTEPS TRAIL OFF.

                             CARLOTTA (O.S.)
                 The master bedroom is this way.
                 It affords a beautiful view of
                 the front grounds.


End of scene.

And so far there are still no differences between the way DC's and Grayson Hall's scripts are written. However, in DC's script he has notations for Scene 31: "Hand Held," "also HIGH FROM 2nd FLOOR hold all the way," and "Try a side track all in profile CU as they go up stairs" - and for Scene 32 he has the notation: "Cut Too: HIG ANG" (no doubt meaning a high angle). Though the interesting thing is almost none of that is how things were shot in what was used in the film. And Grayson's script also has a notation for Scene 32, but more on that when we get to the differences in the dialogue.

And when it comes to any differences in the dialogue, Carlotta actually says "As a child I used to hide here. So many parties in those days. And the guests were so" over the end of Scene 30 as she, Tracy and Quentin disappear up the stairs and mostly off screen - the only part that's delivered during Scene 31 and on screen is "elegantly dressed. And the candles were always burning" - and when Tracy questions if Carlotta lived at Collinwood as a child, it's actually said at the end of Scene 31 and into the beginning of Scene 32 and mostly off camera - and Carlotta's actual reply is "Yes. My mother was the housekeeper" (and it's interesting how Carlotta isn't actually speaking of her own childhood - but of course, no viewers would actually pick up on that this early in the film) - and when Quentin looks up and inquires what's up higher than where they are, Caroltta actually replies with "Oh, nothing you'd be interested in now" - and after Quentin asks if it's the tower, Carlotta simply replies with "Yes", with the "It's used for storage now" dropped - and after disappearing off screen, what Carlotta then actually says is "The master bedroom is this way. It has an excellent view of the front grounds" (and that's where in Grayson's script she's made a notation crossing out "affords" and substituting "has" - though there isn't any notation crossing out "a beautiful" and substituting "an excellent").

...

 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1183 on: August 21, 2023, 07:34:36 PM »
When it comes to the subtitles and the closed captioning for Scene 30:

As scripted, Scene 30 has no dialogue - however unscripted dialogue does appear in it - as Carlotta continues her tour of the house, in both the subtitles and the closed captioning she informs -




- and then she continues in the closed captioning with -


- as she does in the subtitles -


- which also go beyond that - but the closed captioning catches up -


 [nods]

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

  • Systems Manager /
  • Administrator
  • NEW SUPERNAL SCEPTER
  • *****
  • Posts: 16082
  • Karma: +205/-12187
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Happy 50th Anniversary, Night of Dark Shadows
« Reply #1184 on: August 21, 2023, 11:02:00 PM »
A post about Scene 30 that's worth revisiting:

...

...the scene is shot exactly as scripted. But what is interesting is that it includes unscripted dialogue as Carlotta explains "Collinwood was built by Joshua Collins in the late 1600s. Of course, there have been many changes and additions since then." And given that Sam Hall once remarked that due to DC's "newfound directorial style," the original cut of NoDS (the cut before the 129 minutes long recovered cut) was supposedly 165 minutes long and that length was at least partly because the cut supposedly included several instances of shots of characters simply walking down long halls before they get to the points of scenes, I've often wondered if that bit of dialogue from Carlotta was added in post production so as not to have Carlotta, Tracy and Quentin be seen to be simply walking down the corridor from the drawing room to the stairwell? But who knows? But what's also interesting is that in this instance it was SH himself who wrote Scene 30 to simply be them walking down the corridor, so he certainly couldn't blame DC's directorial style for it in that instance.

And there are still no differences between the way DC's and Grayson Hall's scripts are written up to this point.

 [nods]