ShadowGram #159 / merged w/ ShadowGram's Obituary for Craig...What is up here?

Half of it was, the half that quoted the Times about what the actors died from that were in the play "Boys in The Band"

I haven't seen the post; if one of the other mods edited your comments, then they can provide the explanation.  But I can assure you that it was not removed because of a lack of sensitivity, or because it stated that Joel Crothers, Chris Bernau, or Keith Prentice died from complications of AIDS when this information has been published in Craig's "Barnabas & Company." However, and please correct me if I'm wrong, I understood that it was omitted from all of Joel Crother's obituaries at the time of his death at the request of his family.  Thankfully, Craig rectified this.

There is alot of passion on this subject. It comes down to the fact the man was well loved by many people. In the end it does not really matter what other people think of you. The people who love you,care for you when you are sick and make you feel good about yourself are the ones that count.
Not mentioning someone's live partner was in poor taste but in the end when we all go it is not the obituary that tells about us, it is the friends,family and loved ones who share their memories of us, cry and laugh together. No piece of paper,publication or newspapter can put in words our true worth or the value of a relationship.
Just my thoughts
Teresa

Wasn't Louis Edmonds retired by the time BIG LOU was published?

Nancy

 You deleted something Mcfly said.

I was also told that by someone not involved in fandom but knew Joel Crothers.  I don't know whether it's true or not.

Just as a sidebar: I'm all for someone being loud and proud about who they are.  I don't like people who "out" those who are still struggling to come to terms with their orientation.  I recall one such "outing" lead to the suicide of the person who was outed.  The individual was still trying to come to terms with it and not ready.  That has to be respected as a matter of common decency.

Nancy

However, and please correct me if I'm wrong, I understood that it was omitted from all of Joel Crother's obituaries at the request of his family.  Thankfully, Craig rectified this.

Why I bother with this, I don't know.  Don't take what I said and twist and turn it to mean something else.

Here's the bottom line:
I just find it disrespectful to use someone's death PLUS someone else's failure to note that person's partner in a death notice, as a jumping-off point to preach and politicize.  Then it goes into someone else's personal problems of being persecuted by DS fans five years ago.  I was under the impression that these different types of political issues were off limits here.

It also struck me as unfair to make negative assumptions about someone because they didn't put any survived-by info in a newsletter.  That's why I didn't think it appropriate to make inferences in a public manner.  No one knows what is in her heart or why or why not Craig's partner was not mentioned.

For the record:  I feel a person's partner/soul-mate - whatever you want to call them, should always be noted in an obituary in the same way anyone's loved ones are noted.  That does not mean however, that I would jump to conclusions about the writer if they were to omit something.

That's all.  Now if it makes some of you feel better to preach at me, or make certain assumptions about me, (someone you don't even know), then by all means, go to it.  This is the very thing you are decrying.

AGREED which is what we are also trying to accomplish here by having this frank and open dialogue sharing with each other...and hopefully also to get people to think differently moving forward.

There is alot of passion on this subject. It comes down to the fact the man was well loved by many people. In the end it does not really matter what other people think of you. The people who love you,care for you when you are sick and make you feel good about yourself are the ones that count.
Not mentioning someone's live partner was in poor taste but in the end when we all go it is not the obituary that tells about us, it is the friends,family and loved ones who share their memories of us, cry and laugh together. No piece of paper,publication or newspapter can put in words our true worth or the value of a relationship.

Connie: when noting the cause of death for Joel Crothers, Chris Bernau & Keith Prentice, Shadowgram has lied for years.
They died of AIDS.

Once is an honest mistake.
After 20 years, it ceases to be a mistake.
And, BTW, Louis told me that Keith Prentice was also an out gay man.
So why cover it up?

Furthermore, Shadowgram NEVER acknowledges same sex partnerhips within fandom, EVER.
Not even when both parties in the couple are out.

David

You deleted something Mcfly said.

Yes, I did, because it violated her user agreement.  If she wants further clarification, I will explain it to her off the boards.

hmmmmmm...I accept your apology

Why I bother with this, I don't know.  Don't take what I said and twist and turn it to mean something else. 

Here's the bottom line:
I just find it disrespectful to use someone's death PLUS someone else's failure to note that person's partner in a death notice, as a jumping-off point to preach and politicize.  Then it goes into someone else's personal problems of being persecuted by DS fans five years ago.  I was under the impression that these different types of political issues were off limits here.

It also struck me as unfair to make negative assumptions about someone because they didn't put any survived-by info in a newsletter.  That's why I didn't think it appropriate to make inferences in a public manner.  No one knows what is in her heart or why or why not Craig's partner was not mentioned.

For the record:  I feel a person's partner/soul-mate - whatever you want to call them, should always be noted in an obituary in the same way anyone's loved ones are noted.  That does not mean however, that I would jump to conclusions about the writer if they were to omit something. 

That's all.  Now if it makes some of you feel better to preach at me, or make certain assumptions about me, (someone you don't even know), then by all means, go to it.  This is the very thing you are decrying.

Here's the bottom line:
I just find it disrespectful to use someone's death PLUS someone else's failure to note that person's partner in a death notice, as a jumping-off point to preach and politicize.  Then it goes into someone else's personal problems of being persecuted by DS fans five years ago.  I was under the impression that these different types of political issues were off limits here.

This is a political issue pertaining to DS fandom.  And as MB said, ShadowGram is a DS publication.  What you are calling "a jump to conclusions," I call an established pattern.

Besides, you lampooned fan politics yourself recently in this post:

I'm not knowledgeable about DS fandom.

You're fortunate in this regard.

   <sure>

Whoa. Looks like my post went in Mr. Ed's compost pile.
Let it go, folks. We have mega issues overseas AND here at home.
For Christs sake! Can't we all get along???
F**k it. I'm off to watch "Leave it to Beaver".
I want to watch Ward make the Beave a happy camper...

I don't see this thread as having anything to do with political beliefs.  It has been a longstanding "tradition" in the history of obituraries to mention the survivors especially those with whom there is a romantic relationship be it married, not married or somewhere in between.  We see this every single day in the newspaper.  It has nothing to do with politics or one's political beliefs.

Nancy

hmmmmmm...I accept your apology

John, did I mention that I love you! 

You know after 20 years do you really think the publication will change it's stripes? No matter what we yell about here at each other blinders will remain on some in FanDumb and will always remain.

Let's close this discussion with a prayer for peace and understanding AND heart felt sympathy to Joe, Craig's spouse.
And the hopes that the future will bring tolerance and understanding and celebration of our differences.

Special Message to my friends I love you all  Peter, John, Buzz and my Special Karlenfan   and MsCriseyde!

LdyAnne