OT: Haunted House

[Cassandra]

Hi, Cassandra! I moved the face to below the plant to Evan's left. See it now? I don't know how to just circle a photo, as you did. So I had to move it to make it obvious. I see your phantom face now too (now that it's circled).

OMG I feel so stupid Dom,  now I see what you were referring to!  That is a weird looking face, reminds me of Zorro with those eyes, LOL!!

Maybe the guy in the cowboy hat is the ghost of Peter Bradford! LOL! Remember that corny, hatted dark phantom they used on the show that ended up being Peter bradford? 

ROTFL!!!


Cassandra

[Birdie]

Of course Connie, we also held many a seance.  Still love candles and antiques.  My mother just gave me an antique mantle clock for Christmas.  It chimes so very beautifully, and it is driving the rest of my family crazy.  Yet, another benift.  My husband has been getting points by whinding the banjo clock in the living room too.  O.K. I have a thing fro clocks.  I also have many candlesticks around the house.

Birdie

[CastleBee]

Nah, dogs don't always respond....bring a cat though

Oh yeah! I will second that one. My dogs could be just lounging around while my cats - especially the gorgeous and intelligent tabby Megan would suddenly look up and turn to stare wide-eyed into a dark room.  I don't know what she was looking at but I have a very strong feeling it was definately SOMETHING.

Also, regarding animals in situations like this, after each of those dear ones passed on I felt their prescence at different times.  With the cats I felt the familiar pressure of their paws walking across the bed - in ways typical to each cat.  With the dogs I felt the right corner of my bed being bumped the way my corgi Casey would do almost every night.  My sister mentioned that she had a similar experience when her dog Maddie died.  I never found it scary though - just kind of oddly comforting.  All the animals were extremely well loved so maybe they just weren't quite ready to leave.   

[CastleBee]

Back in college a friend and I read many of demonologists Ed and Larraine Warren's books and they were interesting but also very frightening.  In fact, I suggested to my spirit-infested friends that they contact the Warrens, which they did.

I was just reading about the Warrens not long ago.  It probably won't surprise anyone to find out that they too have a web site ...

http://www.warrens.net/ for those who want to "read more about it".

[LorraineAAB]

Back in college a friend and I read many of demonologists Ed and Larraine Warren's books and they were interesting but also very frightening.  In fact, I suggested to my spirit-infested friends that they contact the Warrens, which they did.

As an uncertified skeptic, I recommend that people also look at these:

http://www.legendofdudleytown.com/warren.html

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/archive/features/97/08/14/SKEPTICS.html

http://www.theness.com/articles/warrens-cs0203.html

http://www.theness.com/articles/ghostbusting-csc0103.html

http://www.amityvillemurders.com/

As you might have gathered, I am not all that wild for the Warrens, as I used to be in my more credulous youth.  Not that I don't doubt their sincerity--- however, as one (certified) skeptic put it, "One shouldn't mistake sincerity for authenticity."  I do not believe reality is completely subjective, though individuals can interpret it differently than the majority.  And science isn't infallible.  But it's far less likely to play on the emotions of the vulnerable.

And while I don't believe in the supernatural, I think human beings have a spiritual component, though I am not sure any individual has the right to claim that he or she has a direct line to whatever Prime Mover, or intercessor.  Why, after all, should an angel bother to help someone with a relatively trivial problem, and allow 30,000 innocent people to die in an earthquake in their sleep, or face a massacre, or a slow painful death from cancer, or what have you?

As to the Warrens themselves, again, while, by all accounts, even from their detractors, that they DO believe what they say, and while I admire their moxie and prescience at taking up their occupation at just the right time (after a series of humdrum and unsuccessful careers) and making good, old-fashioned American success, trouble seems to follow in their wake.

Their "investigations" of Union cemetery in Easton have attracted the curious, who have trespassed and inadvertantly vandalized the place, causing innocent others of fearing arrest even during the day.  Their interference with the notorious Ridgefield "demon murder trial" was seen through by the jurors, who understood that the only demon was ther mutual lust and jealousy of two men over one woman.

They played into the hands of Ronald Defeo's attorney, who sought some excuse to get his appalling client sprung from prison with the excuse that the Devil made him kill his family.  The Defeos were a messed-up bunch long before they ever moved to Amityville.  The Warrens' implications also insulted Native Americans by claiming that they impounded their mentally impaired people at the Ocean Avenue site, and that Satanism was practiced there, etc.  Also, abetted the Lutzes, who had gone in over their heads with the mortgage and saw this as a way to recoup their losses (did you know that they returned the very next day after "fleeing" the house, to have a garage sale?)

Also, encouraged the Lindley Street incident in Bridgeport, where a teenaged foster daughter was later caught on videotape knocking over furniture--- an act they had attributed to poltergeists?  (There's a distinct misogynistic bent in supernatural investigations in general, heaping blame upon the disturbing influences of growing girls and older women, which thinking, as I recall, led to the "witch burning times" that targetted mostly females.  Boy, is Lorraine Warren lucky she wasn't born back then.)

Even a cursory reading of their own case histories shows that Ed (who is mostly retired now due to recent ill health)  was not above "leading the witnesses" during his interrogations of those who had contacted him and Lorraine for assistance.  Rather than arriving at supernatural explanations AFTER exhausting all possible NATURAL ones (something referred to in the Hampton Court thread, which I admit I lightheartedly introduced), the Warrens jump right in with supernatural theories FIRST.

Again, this is quite legal, and a matter of free will, but might block someone from thinking objectively about the situation, and seeking a less-disturbing way of solving problems.
(Plus, how many times do I have to repeat about the "photographic evidence"?  Orbs are reflected DUST or DEW.  Arcs are light refractions, or the camera strap falling in front of the lens.  Using old or defective film causes emulsions.  Reflections cause distorted optical illusions.)

 Hey, I love a good story, I love DS, I love Art Bell and George Noory, I loved X-Files and Millennium and Sightings, I still find the Warrens' adventures entertaining (BTW, they only live about 6 miles from me.)  However, I would take EVERYTHING the foregoing say, with a BIG grain of salt.

L

[Gerard]

I'm a skeptic (with an open mind) too, Lorraine.  I love all the stuff about the Warrens because it's, well, fun!  It makes for great reading on a dark, stormy night.  But beyond that, I don't give it all much of a thought.  Also, it is interesting to see how the Amityville case eventually played out, showing that it was all a hoax.  But, again, it sure was fun!

Gerard

[Happybat]

Thanks for the fascinating links, Lorraine.  I think it is important to have a look at the evidence of the skeptics, as much of what they say does make a lot of sense.  There is a romance about ghosts and psychic phenomenon that is at once comforting ("evidence" that there is life after death) and intriguing as anything inexplicable will always be to people.  I believe that those two factors tend to make people ignore or dismiss any logical arguments that might explain away such phenomenon.  That is a pity.

Perhaps after investing some 40 years of their lives to investigating and believing in ghosts and demons, it would be too difficult for the Warrens to admit to themselves or to others that they may be wrong.  That may be a shame, although I can certainly understand why.

The article about Dudleytown was very interesting.  My college friend and I actually visited Dudleytown and Mt. Riga, CT, another alleged site of paranormal activity, back in 1982 on a beautiful summer day.  Mt. Riga had its share of houses but there seemed to be no one there and, oddly, no bird song of any kind.  In short, the place seemed rather creepy although that may have been due as much to the power of suggestion as to anything else.  After both seeing an odd reflection in the window of a "haunted" house, we decided to leave in a hurry!  Dudleytown was a wooded area with some old foundations.  We saw nothing, but again, what we read about this place lent it a tragic, abandoned quality.  Yes, we were probably very gullible but I had to admit that our ghost hunting excursions were also a lot of fun! So, I agree with you too, Gerard. 

P.S. The writer of the first article you list does make a mistake of his own: Henry VII was Henry VIII's father, not his brother, who I believe, died very young. 

[LorraineAAB]

Thanks for the fascinating links, Lorraine.  I think it is important to have a look at the evidence of the skeptics, as much of what they say does make a lot of sense.  There is a romance about ghosts and psychic phenomenon that is at once comforting ("evidence" that there is life after death) and intriguing as anything inexplicable will always be to people.  I believe that those two factors tend to make people ignore or dismiss any logical arguments that might explain away such phenomenon.  That is a pity.

Perhaps after investing some 40 years of their lives to investigating and believing in ghosts and demons, it would be too difficult for the Warrens to admit to themselves or to others that they may be wrong.  That may be a shame, although I can certainly understand why.

They can believe whatever they want, and people who believe they can help, well, I SUPPOSE there's something to be said for psychological relief that is not drug-induced or drawn-out with years of pointless psychoanalysis.

However, in this house, where I have lived 42 years, we have since had a family death (right in my presence), someone who was dying (spent last hours in Hospice), plus the deaths of a couple of beloved pets.  Though these were all natural ends, a couple were untimely, and only one was "easy."  There was plenty of unfinished business, even with the pets, and plenty of grief expended over all.  Yet, we have had NO intimations that their spirits are, in any way, present, and if some superstitious person came in here, and suggested they were, I would have to ask that person to leave.  Ordinary sadness over my loved ones' absence is more than enough stress for us.

What I took particular umbrage at, was Ed tasking such umbrage at the skeptics with whom he had worked, that he denounced ALL skeptics as "Anti-Christs."  Now, I'm not PERFECT, but an Anti-Christ?   

I actually visited Dudleytown and Mt. Riga, CT, another alleged site of paranormal activity, back in 1982 on a beautiful summer day.  Mt. Riga had its share of houses but there seemed to be no one there and, oddly, no bird song of any kind.  In short, the place seemed rather creepy although that may have been due as much to the power of suggestion as to anything else.  After both seeing an odd reflection in the window of a "haunted" house, we decided to leave in a hurry!  Dudleytown was a wooded area with some old foundations.  We saw nothing, but again, what we read about this place lent it a tragic, abandoned quality.  Yes, we were probably very gullible but I had to admit that our ghost hunting excursions were also a lot of fun! So, I agree with you too, Gerard. 

I love the Cornwall area, and when my brother was alive, I knew he had been to D'town, and begged him to take me there.  But alas, such was not to be.    He said it wasn't haunted, but there WAS a weird huge bush growing smack in the middle of the main pathway at the time (late 1970's) planted, no doubt, to discourage ghost-hunters-- and OUTLAW BIKERS !   In fact, as the site says, the area is supposed to be a No-Trespassing zone (in part, due to those old rumors.)  Pity, because Condo-necticut has a shortage of weird and wonderful places to excite the imagination.  Wait a few years--- SOMEBODY will figure out how to build fine McMansions or luxury townhouses up there, no matter WHAT those Warrens say! (Paging Roger Davis )

P.S. The writer of the first article you list does make a mistake of his own: Henry VII was Henry VIII's father, not his brother, who I believe, died very young.

Henry VII's eldest son was Arthur, who was married to Catharine of Aragon and died at age 16, leaving his widow to later wed younger bro Henry VIII, which eventually led to all the divorces and beheadings that helped make Hampton Court the ---allegedly--- "haunted" palace it is today !!!

L.