Anyone know anything new on WB dark shadows pilot

[jimbo]

As Darren pointed out, the script for the proposed WB DS is currently being written. And when one considers that the 2 hour pilot for the '91 NBC series didn't begin shooting until March 19, 1990 (and wrapped on April 11th), there's still plenty of time to finish the script and cast it if/when the WB gives the go-ahead. 

Just out of extreme curiosity, does anyone know specifically why Fox was unhappy with last years DS pilot?

[dom]

Great question, jimbo. I hope someone here knows the answer.

[picard]

all right ypu guys, so we won't take the whole intro of barnabas thing and redo it, what will potential new viewers think. They won't know any basis or ground for the characters, old or new, if this new WB pilot airs next fall. I am speaking of people who do not nothing about the original series. I think i would be confused if all of a sudden i were a new viewer and all of a sudden a vampire named barnabas collins showed up on screen and did what he did in the original series and what ever they decide to have him do in this new pilot. They should at least do the inro of barnabas story to introduce him to the new viewers. They must not sacrifice the character and dramatic and romantic side of barnabas that made him so likeable in the original series, both as a vampire and a human. He used that to charm people and not to lure his victims. So what ever they call for him to do in this new pilot he must have the same qualities that the original barnabas had. Knowing that no one could come close to johnathan frid's portrayal of barnabas in the original series. I am also concerned of the casting for this new pilot for the WB. The WB is infamous for casting all teenage casts for it's shows. Dark shadows is not about some teenage garbage nor should it be made to be like teenage garbage. Nor do i think that the 21st century setting should influence the way it is made and played out. That would sacrifice character and atmosphere and the effect.  Maybe a more plausible take could be on what happend to barnabas and the collins family after barnabas, julia and professor stokes returned from 1840. we never got a proper series finale instead we got stuck with 1841 parallel time garbage. This new version of dark shadows must not have an all teenage cast. Johnathan frid had at least a few crow's feet on his head when he was cast as barnabas. I think the minimum casting age for him would be from 32 on up. Roger from 38 on up. Elizabeth from 42 up. david from 9 to 10. Carolyn 18 exactly. Victoria from 18 o 28. Mrs.Johnson can be anything from 40 on up.  Willie in the mid 20's. I don't know but there had better not be an all teenage cast. There must be some familiar ground for us original dark shadows fans to go on. I will watch this new pilot when and if it airs next fall like a hawk and if it steps out of my line of personal expectations i will not watch it beyond the first episode and will only look at the listings at the tv guide if something good comes along.

[Stuart]

Of course you can manage without an introduction to Barnabas -- it's so easy to do...  He's a guy no one knows too much about, brooding and distant with shadows in his past and a secret that threatens his future.  That's all a new viewer needs -- if anything, it makes the whole vampire thing a much bigger surprise than the hand-out-of-a-coffin stuff ever could.

With a new version nothing is sacred.  Nothing's nailed down and nothing needs to be obeyed -- all that's needed is imagination and an open mind to the possibilities.

[Raineypark]

I think those among us who feel as you do, picard, that the only acceptable new version of DS would be one as closely identical as possible, are in for much disappointment.

Consider it this way.....the original Dark Shadows already exists.  It was created and produced and it exists in a permanent state.  Thanks to the marvels of modern technology, it will shortly be available in its entirety for anyone who cares to spend the money to own it.  You can then watch it, in its perfect original state, any time you wish, exactly as it was.

That being the case.....why on earth would anyone attempt to RE-CREATE what already exists?

To begin with, it's impossible.....all the original performers, writers, crew and what-all are either dead or too elderly to perform their original roles.  Time doesn't stand still for anyone....nor does it run backward.

That being so, why should a new production not take a new direction?  It could be a re-telling of the original story in a new form.....or it could be a "next generation" approach.....or it could be an infinite number of "other" things, limited only by what the new production staff choses.

They might choose to be reverent towards the original, please all the old fans, and create no new fans at all.  Or they might chose to ignore the old fans, and find a new audience with a very different version of the story.   Either choice limits their chance at a successful run.  So it's reasonable to assume they will choose to find a middle ground that will somewhat satisfy older fans, and hopefully intrigue new ones.

No matter what....the original still exists.  It won't be in any way diminished or changed, no matter what comes next.  And if that 's the only version you ever want to see....why then, you have no need ever to watch a new one at all.

[Julia99]

and then there are those of us who wished they'd just leave well enough alone. . .the original was what we love and that type of affection wont be recreated.

[Raineypark]

I agree it would be very hard to make old fans love a new version as much as we love the old one.....but why assume that a new version couldn't generate the same enthusiasm and affection in a new audience?  And why shouldn't younger fans be given that same chance?

Kids who've grown up on increasingly breathtaking special effects can't be faulted for finding the original visually dull in comparison.  That doesn't mean they wouldn't find the story equally compelling if it looked more like the world they've grown up with. 

[picard]

Kids who think that special effects are the key to good story telling and tv and movies are very  dumb and thick skulled. I don't remember when exactly when  i discovered dark shadows, probably a few years ago and i have already been raised on over the top special effects and when i happend to stumble on dark shadows one day when i was sick home from school(this was during the firsts season) on the sci fi channel i was pulled in by the suspense and content of the storys and the characters and as i watched more of it and into the barnabas and further supernatural strorylines i learned how important character and atmospehere and content where to dark shadows and to good storytelling. I also know this as i think it is also doing bad to the star trek franchise, of which i am an avid fan of.  a new version of dark shadows viewed by newbies to dark shadows without watching the original dark shadows won't get what dark shadows truly is. How good the original was and still is. The original dark shadows series won over it's fans with basically the minimal amount of special effects, and basicly relied on it's conten, character and atmosphere to carry it to success. If dark shadows is changed to the stuff that kids have grown up with now, the character, content and atmosphere of the storylines and of what dark shadows is will be sacrificed and overlooked and severly hurt

[Stuart]

Kids who think that special effects are the key to good story telling and tv and movies are very  dumb and thick skulled.

I find that a very misleading statement - Raineypark's post remarked on a younger generation struggling with a "visually dull" original - storytelling never came into it.

Sure, DS was cherishably great at times. However, there was also a lot of dross, substandard production and outright stupid excesses along the way.  It's important to retain that perspective.  A new version can't survive on fans alone -- as I think I pointed out elsewhere, the entire fan audience could switch off after the first episode and it would be a blip on the ratings, if anything.

None of the arguments about new producers not "getting what Dark Shadows truly is" convince me.  Firstly, I haven't a clue what that statement actually means -- and I think if pressed, the original poster would struggle to define that term in any tangible way.  And secondly, it boils down to the same irrational argument of blindly slating something that hasn't even been written, let alone cast or filmed.

I see no reason why a new version can't unite the strengths of the original with the benefits of hindsight and a more sophisticated production.  Ethos is a lot more important to the show than mythos, I think.  Beyond that, it's just a case of telling good stories... that's all that counts.

[picard]

That may be all well and true, but telling good stories is not just what it is about. It has tol tell stories that are uniquely dark shadows and indistiwuishably darks shadows. It has to have the appeal to young,new viewers that the original had, but still tell the same calibur and quality of stories as the original that pulled us in and never let go. It has to have some of the familiar characters to provide a base for us original series fans as well as some of the same settings. But it must not have an all teenage cast. The only teenager i want to see on the new pilot is an 18 year old carolyn and a 20+ vicki. so i have decided to relax my requirements for the original series...
1.Same opening sequence and music.
2.Some of the same characters and settings to provide a base for us original series fans.
3.If it has to, new storylines.
4.Do not overdo it on the special effects, make sure the emphasis is on the character, content and atmosphere and the storyline.
5.no all teenage cast.
6.no comedy, unless a boom microphone or camera gets into a shot or the actors flub  the lines or sets falling down.
7.be serious with what they are trying to accomplish. it cannot take a light hearted, comedy fillled take on it. Dark Shadows has always been serious at what it does. It cannnot be like al the other so called supernatural shows like flufffy buffy, angel or any other of that garbage.  And i am not saying that the original was picture perfect production, but it focused more on character and content and atmosphere and relied less on special effects. On that and the acting in the original series, no revival, remake or new series will be as good as the original. That is a view we also have to keep in mind.

[Stuart]

That may be all well and true, but telling good stories is not just what it is about. It has tol tell stories that are uniquely dark shadows and indistiwuishably darks shadows.

As I said before, I'd love to know what that actually means...  and, following on from that, why that's such a tall order?

i have decided to relax my requirements for the original series...

John Wells breathes a sigh of relief...

6.no comedy, unless a boom microphone or camera gets into a shot or the actors flub  the lines or sets falling down.

Riggggghhht...  So, substandard production is perfectly okay, but daring to introduce a human dimension like wit isn't?  Makes perfect sense.  I dunno -- were I a more cynical person, I'd assume you're being very witty...

 

[Midnite]

Can we please have this discussion without trying to annoy each other?

[Luciaphile]

I doubt we need to worry about production values. If there's one thing they accomplished well with 1991, it was those. And these days, that would be expected. This ain't gonna be MST3K with a guy underneath a VW van making it move with a 2 x 4.

I could even deal with a younger cast although how they're going to have an adolescent Vicki tutoring David Collins in this day and age I do not know. Even the private schools usually want someone with a B.A. But hey! Wait, she's a child prodigy--the Doogie Hauser of the governess set  , yeah, that could work.

Giving this more thought than it probably deserves. This is what I want:

All I want is a decent script. They want to have Victoria Winters arrive on the Greyhound bus or whatever to home school David Collins. Fine. They want to redo the same story. Fine. I want good dialogue. I want character development. I want subtlety. I want decent plotting.

There's a snowball in hell with my name on it.

 

[Nicole]

Excuse me, but what is an indistinguishably Dark Shadows story?  The writers were notorious for ripping storylines from horror, science fiction, and gothic novels/movies.  Dark Shadows stories are variations on stories that have been told for ages.  Sometimes those stories were well adapted (the 1968-9 The Turn of the Screw storyline for instance) or badly adapted (perhaps the Adam/Eve rip that had once been called Frankenstein).  It may be important for the show to stay within its genre, but its more important for the stories to be well told.

I don't understand why so many are harping on the "all teenaged cast" issue.  I can't think of WB show that has an all teenaged cast that is still being shown today.  I know someone else has brought this point up before (please forgive me for not remembering your name), but WB shows such as Everwood and Seventh Heaven do give time to develop their adult characters.  Angel is cast with actors way into (or out of) their twenties.  These shows appeal to people of all ages.  For example, my parents, both of whom grew up on the original Dark Shadows, are addicted to Buffy and Angel and are religiously collecting the DVD sets.  Why?  Because they find something within those shows with which they can relate to, regardless of the fact that they may be older than the cast.  That, at least in my opinion, is what a good show does.

How much like the original Dark Shadows should the revival be?  I don't really know.  I think we all have things we love about the original but we must realize that this new show cannot recreate those settings.  Can a new show be as good as the original?  Maybe not for an original fan, but, for a new fan who has little familiarity with the original, this new show may obviously eclipse it in the mind of a new viewer.  Of course, any positive interest that this new show brings to the original show can only be good (like sparking greater interest in the movies for instance).  If this revival makes it past the planning stages, I think all we can hope for is that they professionally tell a good story that sparks enthusiastic discussion as the original has done so well.

[Darren Gross]

Let's simplify things for the moment...It's always been my contention that Dark Shadows is NOT a high concept show. I always felt that it doesn't have a simple basic one sentence description that encapsulates it...This is what makes it a hard sell and difficult to sequelize and re-do...

In other words, something like star trek or Doctor Who has a very simple premise; 1- In the future a spaceship crew explore new worlds and encounter various forms of new life, 2: An eccentric alien scientist and his companions travel into various times and different planets and end up trying to help the forces of good prevail in some kind of struggle.

My challenge is simply this- Post a one sentence 'high-concept' description of what DS is. That's it. Then we'll see what we get...