DS meets OLTL

[Patti Feinberg]

I so often see so many reminders while watching OLTL in regards to Dark Shadows.

I won't go into many here (like the recently revealed hidden chamber in Llanfair!!) AND very importantly, people were recently posting about the way the DS writers weren't given enough time to 'develop' JebEZ's good (er) characteristics; OLTL did the SAME hurry up job with Mitch.

Today, while watching, I started thinking of the characters (SYT).

Take 'twin's  OLTL Jessica & Natalie; I'll presume they're about 21ish (they drink booze legally on the show).
Yes, they're sweet young things, and I really like the Natalie character & actress (Please God do NOT make me go there about Jessica )

But let's consider Nancy Barrett & TLATKLS; I believe they were both born in 1945, making them 22ish at the beginning of DS (1966).

They both seem so much more 'mature'; even Kitten spoiled Carolyn, no job, idle rich, still seems so much more deeper than the aforementioned OLTL characters.

Certainly, Maggie Evans (think the early days!) had so much more depth.

We all hear (and probably, most of us SAY), these kids today, they have it so easy...yada yada.

Anyone care to elaborate?

Patti

[Raineypark]

Soap operas today have no middle class, (never MIND working class) people.  Everyone is a billionaire.  I gave up watching "General Hospital" years ago when I realised they had nothing left but the super-rich.

Yes....the Collins Family was wealthy....but Maggie waited tables, and Joe had a job, and the Blue Whale was a local bar in a fishing town.  No one owned a cosmetics company or a record company, or was a mobster, or a jewel thief.

And at least on DS....when somebody came back from the dead.....it made sense.....sort of......!


And about kids having it so easy these days......my daughter just found out that one of her 16-year-old friends died yesterday morning in a horrific car crash.  The driver was 17, stoned, and doing 120mph on a winding road.  It was inevitable....no graduating class from our High School ever publishes a year book without an "In Memorium" page.  It happens at least once, every damned year.  Sometimes I think about moving into the city and NEVER letting her learn to drive. 

[Birdie]

Raineypark,
                    Hearing the news of yet another young person dying in a car wreck breaks my heart.  I feel very sad for your daughter and her classmates.  Everytime I read about one of these horrific accidents my heart breaks for both the parents fo the victim and the one driving the car.  Too many lives cut short or ruined.

I know the young people today have a lot more to deal with in other ways.

Maggie and Carolyn were about my older sisters age.  The way women dressed and the manner in which they spoke leads one to think they are more mature.  That era also was less materalistily spoiled.  Lets face it young people of today have everything.  Not enough of them have to work for it.  My older two children remind me all the time they were of the very few who did not have a car in high school.  In fact they still are dependant on the use of our car until they are out of college and can afford one on their own.  This does not make our life easier but we deal

Birdie--who once again rambles on

[Mysterious Benefactor]

But let's consider Nancy Barrett & TLATKLS; I believe they were both born in 1945, making them 22ish at the beginning of DS (1966).

The exact date of Carolyn's birthday changes in different storylines, but the year of her birth is most often (at least three times) referred to as 1949. When DS begins in 1966, Carolyn is 17 (Vicki is 20).

On the other hand, I don't think any DS storyline actually provides any way to pinpoint Maggie's age. However, for what it's worth, Art Wallace's character bio for Maggie in his Shadows on the Wall bible says that she's supposed to be 23 in 1966. (And BTW, Joe is supposed to be 21, Burke - 32, Sam - 53, Liz - 56, Roger - 36.)

[Mysterious Benefactor]

Soap operas today have no middle class, (never MIND working class) people.  Everyone is a billionaire.  I gave up watching "General Hospital" years ago when I realised they had nothing left but the super-rich.

Yes....the Collins Family was wealthy....but Maggie waited tables, and Joe had a job, and the Blue Whale was a local bar in a fishing town.  No one owned a cosmetics company or a record company, or was a mobster, or a jewel thief.

Apparently the ideas that soap characters should be "larger than life" and that characters/storylines should have little in common with real life are ones that persist even today.

[Josette]

But let's consider Nancy Barrett & TLATKLS; I believe they were both born in 1945, making them 22ish at the beginning of DS (1966).

The exact date of Carolyn's birthday changes in different storylines, but the year of her birth is most often (at least three times) referred to as 1949. When DS begins in 1966, Carolyn is 17 (Vicki is 20).

On the other hand, I don't think any DS storyline actually provides any way to pinpoint Maggie's age. However, for what it's worth, Art Wallace's character bio for Maggie in his Shadows on the Wall bible says that she's supposed to be 23 in 1966. (And BTW, Joe is supposed to be 21, Burke - 32, Sam - 53, Liz - 56, Roger - 36.)

Wow!  I knew there was supposed to be a gap between Liz and Roger, but I had no idea they were supposed to be that far apart.  And, it could help explain her marrying Paul - she was "getting up there" in terms of marrying age and having children at that point.  I had no idea!!

I would have thought Carolyn was at least 18, though.  I assumed she was already through with high school, which she could be but probably wouldn't be at 17.  And, I had assumed she knew Joe through school and figured he was at most a couple of years older than she was, but then, I guess she did kind of go for "older men"!!

[Cassandra]

I would have thought Carolyn was at least 18, though.  I assumed she was already through with high school, which she could be but probably wouldn't be at 17.  And, I had assumed she knew Joe through school and figured he was at most a couple of years older than she was, but then, I guess she did kind of go for "older men"!!

Although Im not sure I don't remember there ever being a mention of Carolyn's schooling years on DS.  And I can't imagine her going to the local high school if she did.  Since David doesn't attend school and has a full time Governess I just assumed that it was the same for Carolyn as well, but who knows.

Rainey, that's so sad!  I cringe everytime I hear of yet another young person dying from a car wreck.  I still feel these kids are too young to behind the wheel of a car and sometimes wish they would push the driving age up to 18.  At least everybody that I know knows of at least 2 or 3 kids that have been killed in a car crash, it's so sad.  My daughter is driving all over the place now too and even though she's a good driver it's always the other person that you got to watch out for.


Patti, I know what you mean about the difference in kids today compared to years ago.  Even the manner of dress was so different!!  My oldest sister was around the same age as Carolyn & Maggie back then and I always remember her as being so mature, so grown up compared to young adults today.  My sister graduatd from high school and got a great job a week later for a large successful company in which she stayed in for 30 years until she retired.  Now, you need a college degree for just about everything, and along with that you have to take so many tests before a large business will hire you anymore.


Cassandra

[doombuggy69]

OLTL and DS have always shared something in common ever since OLTL debuted in 1968. The first thing was in 1968 when OLTL needed a burning fire for their opening credits. They didn't have a working fireplace in their studio, so the crew simply went down to the DS studio and filmed a fire on one of the DS sets. Then around 1975, Sam Hall and Gordon Russell became OLTL's head writers. Sam Hall continued as head writer for the next seven years. However, Gordon Russell left the show in 1979. He was tapped to be the new head writer on "General Hospital" by producer Gloria Monty, but he passed away right before he could start.

Other DS similarities to OLTL occured in 1982 when Grayson Hall, Anthony George and Nancy Barrett all appeared on the show at the same time. Unfortunately, none of them had any scenes together!! Although, Grayson and Anthony George did have a very brief scene together, but I missed taping the show that day. I only have Grayson and Nancy's scenes on tape.  Dennis Patrick had a bit part around that time as well. Then of course in 1988, one of the characters went back in time to 1888 for a few months, in a flashback that reminded many of DS's 1795 storyline. There may be other OLTL DS connections, but those have been a few.

[Gothick]

Wow, doombuggy, you're so lucky to have Grayson and Nancy's work from OLTL in 1982 on tape.  I've seen Grayson's first two episodes on that show--marvelous role for her.  I've never seen any of Nancy's work from that period, alas.

It's claimed in one of the KLS published Pom Press DS books that there *was* one scene on OLTL in which the characters portrayed by Grayson, Nancy, and Tony George met.  Supposedly, the dialogue in the scene revolved around how long it had been since the characters had met!

As I'm sure you've heard, Tony George was a good friend of Grayson's and Sam's. When Grayson started appearing on OLTL, Tony kept joking that he wanted Sam to write a romance storyline for his character and Grayson's!

I never knew about the fire for the original OLTL credits being filmed on the set of DS.  That's fascinating.

Steve

[LoveAtFirstBITE]

And about kids having it so easy these days......my daughter just found out that one of her 16-year-old friends died yesterday morning in a horrific car crash.  The driver was 17, stoned, and doing 120mph on a winding road.  It was inevitable....no graduating class from our High School ever publishes a year book without an "In Memorium" page.  It happens at least once, every damned year.  Sometimes I think about moving into the city and NEVER letting her learn to drive. 

It happens at many high schools.........mine included.  Early last month, a student from the junior class died in a bad car accident--a combination of probable speeding and wet roads.  It was the third time within a year that someone from the school died.  Unfortunately, even though many teens are not reckless drivers, there will always be someone who makes the wrong choice.   

[Midnite]

This connection is a little tenuous, but...

Was watching a horror movie collection this week-- the one Arashi wrote about on another board.  I hope my friend didn't pay a lot for it, but it did allow me to see a few TV movies that I may not have a chance to see otherwise.  One was Dan Curtis' "Scream of the Wolf", which starred Philip Carey as a sheriff forced to investigate a series of werewolfy murders, much in the style of DS or "The Night Stalker" (though on Night Stalker it would've had a much different ending, I'm sure).  Anyone that watched OLTL since the late 70s would know him as THE Buchanan patriarch, Asa.  One of those murders is of a character played by Jim Storm, who plays half of a typical 70s-fare making-out couple that become victims.

My favorite unintentionally funny scene in the movie-- the sheriff and his men speed to the scene of the first murder to disco funkadelic Robert Cobert music.  Oh those wacky 70s!

[Raineypark]

Oh those wacky 70s!

Actually, I remember some of those perfectly awful '70s made-for-TV movies rather fondly....shrieking hysterically at things that were NEVER intended to be funny....  The music was usually the culprit, followed by starlets who screamed like chickens.  And of course, the disco era was the worst period in men's clothing since the loin cloth.

[doombuggy69]

Hi Gothick,

I think your right about the OLTL scene between Grayson, George and Barrett. I have never seen it however. It's too bad Jim Pierson can't secure that scene for a Festival, or MPI compilation.....If it really does exist.  I unfortunately don't have that scene on tape, and was not a faithful OLTL watcher back then. ((I was more into Luke and Laura from GH!! LOL!!))  I think I have some of Grayson's first shows from OLTL.  If I remember correctly, wasn't there a storm raging outside on the first scenes she did??  I guess that was Sam Hall's private injoke to ex DS fans!

The story about the DS fireplace being used on OLTL was told by Nick Besink, who was a former DS stagehand.  He told that story at one of the late 80's NY Festivals.

[Josette]

I would have thought Carolyn was at least 18, though.  I assumed she was already through with high school, which she could be but probably wouldn't be at 17.  And, I had assumed she knew Joe through school and figured he was at most a couple of years older than she was, but then, I guess she did kind of go for "older men"!!

Although Im not sure I don't remember there ever being a mention of Carolyn's schooling years on DS.  And I can't imagine her going to the local high school if she did.  Since David doesn't attend school and has a full time Governess I just assumed that it was the same for Carolyn as well, but who knows.

I kind of think in the early days when she was going with Joe that there were some comments that implied she had gone to a regular school, but I may have just inferred that.

But, there was a scene with her mother once, and she was commenting on what the other kids used to say, perhaps teasing because Liz wouldn't leave the house or something.  At any rate, it definitely implied that she went to school, which did surprise me.

[dom]

I love that scene, Josette. I think Liz said that the kids used to tease Carolyn that her mother was a witch. I laughed out loud the first time I saw and heard that exchange. I love those early episodes...