Discuss - Ep #0428

[Watching Project]

Robservations #428

And if you'd care to look back, the first WP discussion topic for this ep:

Re: Discuss - Ep #0428

[MagnusTrask]

No notes on this one, except it's fun to contemplate Joshua's increased cranial pressure, as he sees Barnabas back in the coffin!

[dom]

As he reveals to Millicent, I didn't realize that Peter knows that Barnabas died. Perhaps Vicki told him?

Very soap opera today. Millicent tries to avenge her own honor. Joshua intercedes and accuses Nathan of murdering Suki, well, sort of - nonetheless - Joshua intends to destroy Nathan's reputation. Intense scenes. Crothers does much better with the slang and contractions of the '60s.

Peter approaches Ben about his knowledge regarding the real witch. Davis does his best Perry Mason but he's no Raymond Burr. Joshua shows up and puts an end to the discussion. David & Edmonds do great - I really enjoyed their scenes. David elevates everyone, though Edmonds rarely needs any help.

I really like the drama of this episode. Joshua tries to goad Ben into revealing what is really going on with Barnabas. It is amazing that Joshua hasn't gone mad - with all that's happened since Josette's arrival. Now, after having Ben open Barn's casket to prove that he is no longer in it, Ben does so and it is occupied. I'm with you, MT, I can't wait to see Joshua try and wrap his mind around this.

[DarkLady]

Joshua treats Millicent with surprising gentleness after rescuing Nathan from her.

Nathan attempts to thank Joshua for saving his life (though he could never have been in any serious danger from such a bird-boned little creature as Millicent). Joshua bars him from setting foot on any and all Collins property, including the shipyard. When Nathan points out that that's where he works, Joshua replies that that's the navy department's problem. Joshua probably thinks he's won, but he has made a very bad enemy.

While Ben is digging Josette's grave, Peter finds him and tries to talk him into testifying for Vicki. Joshua finds them and orders Peter to leave. Glaring suspiciously at Peter, he asks, Stokes, have you been imposed on or coerced in any way? He’s already been imposed on and coerced quite enough already by the Collinses without any help from me, Peter retorts and clears off. Referring to Peter as "that impudent young man," Joshua orders Ben to finish digging Josette's grave tonight. [Now why it should take that long to do, I don't understand, plus apparently nobody ever heard that suicides were supposed to be buried at a crossroads, face down, in an unmarked grave. But I suppose the rich and powerful Collinses can bury themselves wherever they want.]

Nice scene with Joshua and Ben at the mausoleum. It's still daylight, so of course Barnabas is in his coffin--as Ben has known all along.

Really, any scene with Thayer David is great. Ben is also one of my favorite characters.

[MagnusTrask]

Joshua bars him from setting foot on any and all Collins property, including the shipyard. When Nathan points out that that's where he works, Joshua replies that that's the navy department's problem.

 [Now why it should take that long to do, I don't understand, plus apparently nobody ever heard that suicides were supposed to be buried at a crossroads, face down, in an unmarked grave. But I suppose the rich and powerful Collinses can bury themselves wherever they want.]

Further... well, we can hardly dignify them by calling them 'thoughts', but here goes...  Bradford's a basically admirable character, but he's set up to be, so we take that for granted, and thus can't help but to notice all his deviations from this... and I thought he was thoughtless for blurting out that Barnabas was dead.  No doubt when he was told Barnabas was dead, he was also told it was a secret.  In any case, clearly Millicent hadn't a clue, so be careful why don't you, Sledgehammer Pete....

I'm interested in the whole situation of the relationship between private industry and the military back then.   The military had to function through the facilities of private commercial operations?   Nice that we get that bit of historical instruction, if true.

Man, that's harsh, about the burial requirements for suicides, DL.  Was it a religious thing?  Couldn't have been legal.

[DarkLady]

Wow, MT, you raise some interesting questions.

I think I have a good idea of the answer to your first one: Then as now, navy ships are commissioned from and built in privately owned shipyards. Nowadays, they might go to Electric Boat in Groton, Connecticut. With his background as a Patriot, Joshua no doubt has managed to wangle some highly  lucrative contracts from the fledgling U.S. Navy. I think the earliest shipyards were in New England, because that's where all the timber was, so having one in Collinsport actually makes sense. (I've edited a lot of history books, and some interesting but useless factoids have lodged in my brain as a result.)

Suicide actually was illegal in a lot of places, especially those with theocratic tendences. I'm sure it was illegal in Britain. I don't know about Maine, but since it was originally a British colony a lot of the laws would have been similar or the same. The rationale for criminalizing it was that in taking your own life, you were sinning against the Creator himself, who alone has the power of life and death and who was the source (it was believed) of all government power--remember all those divine right rulers. If you survived a suicide attempt, you would go to prison.

The burial upside down at a crossroads was to make sure your soul wouldn't somehow find its way to heaven.

[MagnusTrask]

Suicide actually was illegal in a lot of places, especially those with theocratic tendences. I'm sure it was illegal in Britain. I don't know about Maine, but since it was originally a British colony a lot of the laws would have been similar or the same. The rationale for criminalizing it was that in taking your own life, you were sinning against the Creator himself, who alone has the power of life and death and who was the source (it was believed) of all government power--remember all those divine right rulers. If you survived a suicide attempt, you would go to prison.

The burial upside down at a crossroads was to make sure your soul wouldn't somehow find its way to heaven.

Yikes to twelfth degree.   We wouldn't want to let God decide these things, would we?   Imagine the effrontery of thinking God needed some second-guessing and supervision regarding who to let through the pearly gates....

I'm used to thinking of all military personnel as woirking on government bases... I know private contractors build a lot of equipment, but would US officers have worked at those facilities?

[DarkLady]

Love your comment on the pearly gates, MT!

I suppose Nathan was some kind of consultant. They would need somebody to make sure the ships were being built to the navy's specifications, for example, with the right number and placement of masts, gun ports, whatever.

[Lydia]

The burial upside down at a crossroads was to make sure your soul wouldn't somehow find its way to heaven.

But surely they would have stopped bothering with the upside-down burial when they learned that the earth rotated on an axis - right?

[DarkLady]

Missed you, Lydia!  I guess that tradition developed back when the world was flat.

[alwaysdavid]

Millicent is babbling again and Peter Says Barnabas is dead leading to more Millicent cackles. Josh implies that Nathan had reason to do in Sukey, you think? and then says he will be shot on site for trespassing. Unlit candles and Barnabas is in the coffin to the surprise of his Dad.