the witchcraft nonsense in 1840

[michael c]

i'm still desperately slogging through the 1840 episodes...


however once the "witchcraft" nonsense takes on steam i almost have to just walk away. i mean am i missing something here? why on earth are people in the middle of the nineteenth century, the dawn of the modern age, running around babbling about witchcraft??? why is it being taken seriously? by anyone?

by this point in the run did the writers just assume that those "kids that ran home from school" wouldn't know enough about history to understand that this concept was two hundred years out of date? or because it's DS are we just supposed to throw common sense out the window?

or was it just an excuse for jerry lacey to revive his unbearably obnoxious character from 1795?


incidentally who the heck is david selby supposed to be playing here? he looks and acts and talks just like "real time" quentin right down to the glued on sideburns. i'm surprised they didn't try and give him that stupid gramophone just for the sake of brand continuity. is the viewer just supposed to associate him with "real" quentin and thus give a darn what happens to him? i mean he's supposed to be a different character, right?

this storyline kills me.

[IluvBarnabas]

I'm sorry you're not enjoying 1840. I personally love almost everything about it...including the witchcraft and the trial. Some really great scenes came out of it, such as [spoiler] Desmond grilling Samantha on the stand, Dawson grilling Quentin, the surprise appearance of Joanna, Barnabas triumphanly showing up to defend Quentin to Trask's horror after Trask had walled him up. [/spoiler]

I won't argue that the writers were stretching credibility really wide here and that to be holding a witchcraft trial in the 19th century is silly...but this is a gothic/supernatural show, not Law and Order or CSI. It's not so much throwing out common sense but dispension of belief....I have a great deal of that, and maybe that's why I'm more forgiving of the 1840 witchcraft trial.

I'll take the 1840 Quentin over the 1970 Parallel Time Quentin any day. At least the 1840 Quentin didn't shout and scream all the time and throw a tantrum over the stupidest things.

[Gerard]

I so agree with you.  The 1840/41 (and the previous 1970 lead-in line) was the death knell of DS.  The whole thing, next to the Frankensienian 1968 plot, was the most ridiculous thing of the whole series.  Dan Curtis and the writers got lazy and decided to rehash 1967/1968/1796/1797/1968/1969/1897 into one huge bundle.  I'd rather would've stuck with that insufferable pig Jeb and the Leviathans and stay in PT1970 than go through that.  PT1841 was even so much better.

Gerard

[tragic bat]

The 1840 witchcraft trial was ludicrous, and a very inappropriate recycling of the 1795 storyline (with an extra dose of camp added in.)  You're right that we were supposed to take it seriously, care, and, apparently, sit in suspense as to how everything would turn out.  I managed none of the above.   I feel for you, I was turned off by this ten + years ago when I saw it in the scifi run, and I wouldn't be able to stomach it at all today.  It is too bad that David Selby wasn't given an actually distinct character here, though many of the regulars were playing devolved, degenerated, and generic caricatures of people that were once compelling characters earlier in the series. 

[michael c]

yes i definitely "spotted the fin" with the 1968 adam stuff but the show redeemed itself...


this is definitely the "jump the shark" moment. this thing is done.


if i wasn't determined to watch this thing from start to finish i'd skip it.

[IluvBarnabas]

I can watch any episode of 1840 over and over. I honestly can't say that about any episode with Jeb in it.

[IluvBarnabas]

Come on, I can't be the only one who enjoyed 1840 and appreciates such great characters as Gabriel, Gerard, Samantha, Desmond, Flora, Leticia, etc...

[Gothick]

From a historical point of view, both the 1795 and the 1840 witchcraft hysteria plots are nonsensical.  The idea of legal execution by decapitation in 1840 adds an extra note of camp craziness to the proceedings.  At least in 1840 the trial scenes do not feature Roger Davis and do have some juicy moments, particularly with the ever sublime Humbert Astredo (although I find Dawson his least interesting characterization). 

Lela Swift was the producer of DS during the 1840 period so she gets the blame for some aspects.  But she also deserves some praise for salvaging at least some elements from the story outline foreshadowed in the Summer of 1970 period, which obviously was completely unworkable within the limitations of the DS studio.  Shipboard trysts between Daphne and Gerard?  Coastal raids by bloodthirsty brigands under Gerard's secret command?  I'd love to have a clue about the last minute switches in plan that resulted in Swift just throwing it all into the rubbish bin and forcing the writers to start over. 

To me, Virginia Vestoff deserves a lot of credit for making 1840 at least occasionally watchable.  Her performance of Samantha is actually one of the highlights of the entire series to me, although it is a highlight I revisit very seldom because I find so much of 1840 to be simply beyond the pale.

The character of Joanna was an intriguing touch, and it's too bad the actress (whose name I forget) had such trouble with her dialogue.  There were some great moments in how that story played out, particularly Samantha's confrontations with Joanna. Again, Vestoff gets the credit for making all of this play much more brilliantly than would otherwise have been the case.

G.

[michael c]

yes virginia vestoff's viperous samantha is one of the period's few high points. and any scene with ang at her most deranged is always worth a look.

flora's not bad but lacks the haughtiness that makes a joan bennett characterization so memorable. besides she's a pretty minor character with limited screentime. old timers like joan and louis are clearly no longer the series priorities as the late, younger castmembers dominate the proceedings.

as far as leticia goes she's just warmed over pansey faye for no apparent reason other than that pansey must a have been a popular character at the time. personally i found pansey fun for about five minutes in 1897 and then immensely grating ever after so having a carbon copy of her around for yet another storyline isn't helping.


gothick obviously i'm not through yet but you make it sound as though some of the 1970 mysteries reappear...because for the life of me i cannot see what any of this has to do with tad and carrie, who barely show up at all, the playroom, the java queen or any of the other plot points of the story setup.


i've been trying to figure out what else is missing and i think i know what it is...KLS! i'm not her biggest fan but she certainly lends her distinctively DS presence to all of the other time period and storylines and here her absence feels somehow like a void. while the "josette" element was certainly played out by this point without a KLS character swanning about something feels off.

[michael c]

another little observation about kate jackson...


she has a natural, understated acting style that's slightly at odds with the high drama, high camp "DS style" of most of her costars. she's almost evocative of first year players like alexandra or joel crothers who behaved like normal people and not some over the top character.

[Gerard]

Virginia Vestoff as Samantha was one of the highlights (maybe the only one) about 40/41.  For me, she made the plot watchable.

And I also agree that all the stuff they had in the '70 pre-plot, like the Java Queen and everything else that seemed pertinent, and then just ignoring or brushing it off in 40/41 was very annoying.

Gerard

[Gerard]

i've been trying to figure out what else is missing and i think i know what it is...KLS! i'm not her biggest fan but she certainly lends her distinctively DS presence to all of the other time period and storylines and here her absence feels somehow like a void. while the "josette" element was certainly played out by this point without a KLS character swanning about something feels off.

I think, Michael, that KLS was suppose to play Samantha, but she left the series to get married and head to Europe, so VV was cast in the role.  Although VV was superb, it would've been fun seeing KLS finally play a totally nasty character instead of rehashing another damsel in distress.

Gerard

[michael c]

yes and as roxanne was now barnabas' SYT of choice it would have been interesting to have KLS play a character with no association with josette.

[David]

The witchcraft hysteria of 1840 is no more or less absurd than the nonsense currently being spewed by Rev Pat Robertson on the 700 Club.
But the trial was one of the few things that Sam & Gordon addressed properly in dialogue: doesn't Quentin or someone say "they can't charge anyone with witchcraft--it's not done anymore."
"They can do whatever they want!" replies Desmond. There was also spoken reference to a centuries old law that hadn't been repealed or invoked in years.
So at least there was an attempt to logically explain the behavior of the storyline's villains.

What kills 1840 for me is how Sam & Gordon completely ignore everything they set up during the summer of 1970. Letitia Faye feels shoved in, though the Faye family is given a backstory in the Big Finish CD London's 
 Burning. No explanation whatsoever as to how the stairway thru time worked, though this was finally explained in Big Finish's CD The Path of Fate. Also, the stupefying deaths of Roxanne, Edith & Angelique in 1840, with no explanation offered as to how these deaths affected 1897 and 1968-1970 storylines.
It was obvious at this point that no one cared anymore. They wanted out, and they got there wish, didn't they?

[The Doctor and K9]

Actually, I don't find it totally impossible that an insular, isolated place like Collinsport might give in to witchcraft mania, if it had been done without the knowlege of the outside world. In 1892, Mercy Brown was exhumed and her body difiled in Wakefield, Rhode Island. The town's people thought she was a vampire. A few miles away, the people of Providence were aghast. RI instituted laws about the handling of bodies and requiring post mortems.

Where I part company with 1840 is (and I don't remember if this happened) having a sentence reviewed by a higher court and being upheld. The State of Maine would have sent in the National Guard or whatever.