Author Topic: Discuss - Ep #0779  (Read 2507 times)

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Discuss - Ep #0779
« on: May 14, 2009, 10:33:45 PM »

Offline Taeylor Collins

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2009, 01:45:46 AM »
VO: Lara Parker

OH CRAP!  They give away the fact that we are gonna see Angelique in this episode. That is slightly annoying, but oh well!  The smoke is sure billowing, which adds a nice effect!
 
HELLO to the QMAN!  I like to watch David and Grayson work together! Although that are often fighting, you can sense that they like each other as regular people!  Perhaps I just notice this because I know Grayson was very fond of David and visa versa! 

“Judith is dreaming about her money and so is Edward!” Quentin.  LOL!  He gets some great lines doesn't he? SNICKER!  Oh great close up of David and his gorgeous baby blues!

Carl sprinting about is cracking me up.  John Karlen is very enthusiastic!  Nice nod to the original Barnabas!  Carl annoys me however, I feel sorry for him!  John Karlen is hamming it up!  And the famous blooper with the wobbling stone!
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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2009, 09:01:30 PM »
We pick up with a new scene in which we find out that Barn is moving his digs back to the mausoleum.  He is so very confident that everything is going exactly the way he wants, and NO ONE could possibly find him in the mausoleum.  Every time I see that self satisfied smirk, I just KNOW that whatever he’s so confident about will come back and bite him.  [ghost_wub]

At least Magda has more sense, the way she bits her lip and shakes her head no.  And of course to confirm that Magda is waay smarter than Barnabas, here comes Carl, slinking terrified into the mausoleum because Pansy told him that’s where the vampire is.

Barn at Rachel’s graveside.  Reasonable looking gravestone for  a governess, and we find out that Rachel was born in 1876 and died at 21.

The more Angie keeps trying to warn Barn of what will go wrong, the more I think we’re dealing with both of them being time travelers.  He is bumbling around trying to piece it together and fix things, but she seems to KNOW exactly what will go wrong and keeps trying to give him warnings – which, being Barnabas, he promptly discounts/ignores.
I really like this scene between them.  You can really see Angie’s pov – and why she’s so upset, even hurt.  Apparently she’s been trying to be helpful, but every time it gets thrown in her face.  He’s not even willing to TRY and trust her, not once – even the times when he has nothing to lose by doing so.  So, she's hit the point of the heck with him, I give up, make a mess without my help  then try and get OUT of it without my help.

Barn is just NOT the most observant guy around.  He goes to the mausoleum as himself as opposed to a bat or a puff of smoke, and apparently doesn’t have a CLUE someone is outside watching him.  Carl is right there, not too many places to hide in the graveyard, not a lot of man sized gravestones that we’ve seen out there.   So much for his preternaturally heightened senses. AND he’s probably pissed off Angie, who might have tried to warn him.

Now we see the recently missing Quentin and Magda – but of all the stupid places for a conversation that desperately needs to stay private, the  Drawing Room would be on the top of my list.  Not to mention that the miraculously wandering gramophone has to be there too. LMAO Quentin has the conversation in such a public place, tells her to speak softly because the walls have ears (and what’s wrong with going up to his room?  Even using the never used or referred to since the spook killed Braithwaite secret passage from the Drawing room to the west wing, perhaps?)  Then to top it all off, instead of keeping the gramophone running to muffle voices, he shuts it OFF.  Even drunk he’s usually smarter than that.
But he does show some brains later, when he keeps wondering about why Magda is suddenly so willing to help him.  She almost blows it, and seems to come very close to telling him the real reason.  Good thing he was drunk, that story she substituted is about as thin as one of Barnabas’ alibi’s .

Now in bursts Carl, scared to death of Magda, and dealing with Quentin’s wisecracks.   This is an absolutely wonderful scene.  Carl all panicky and trying to convince the drunk Quentin to take him seriously.  Quentin is humoring Carl, but then picks up on the sense of what he’s saying.  “Our Cousin who never appears in the day.  Our Cousin who always appears at dusk”.  Once the pieces slip together, Quentin sobers up real quick, and his brain kicks into action.  OK something just hit me.  If he knows enough of the basic Vampire lore that he repeats in this scene, HOW did he NOT recognize the bite marks on Beth’s neck?

Selby shows Quentin’s conflict very nicely.  The script only has him indecisive about what to do.  The little bits of business show the deeper conflict, of where does it leave him if he destroys Barnabas, and perhaps the deeper question of how does he judge the victim of another curse when he’s done such terrible things under the influence of his own.

And here we come, up to one of the two scenes which permanently hooked me on the show back in 2002.  I’d caught the last ep by a pure fluke, and decided to start time shifting the next day so I could see the show from the beginning, as I’d not done on the original run. I think Scifi did this around the summer of  2001.  So, here I was happily time shifting watching and recording over the eps, enjoying the show but not enough to keep anything.  Then came 1897 – I recognized why I went so ga ga for Quentin when I was a kid, but still wasn’t saving anything.

Then we come to this episode, and this incident. A desperate Quentin, who by his own admission, doesn’t know WHAT he’s feeling, opens the secret room with Carl, takes the gun – and locks his brother in with the vampire to be killed.

That’s right folks, its all Karlen and Selby’s fault I got hooked.  That’s my story and Im sticking to it.  The scene and its conflicts are absolutely marvelous, and Quentin’s action isn’t really predictable in any way, it just COMES on the spur of the moment.  “I only ever do what I must. The last seat in the lifeboat desperation of the scene and the playing to perfection by two excellent actors , may remind the  Blake’s 7 fans of the climax of an episode called Orbit.

Karlen’s playing of Carl's rising panic and horror, Quentin’s question about whether Carl knows how to get out (is he giving him an out, trying to relieve his conscience or just playing with Carl is very wide open).  Carl apparently believes implicity that Quentin WILL shoot him, else he would have made a break for it.   Now that could be an interesting alternative – them in a fistfight as the door is closing. Quentin doesn’t seem to know what he wants to do, except keep Barnabas from being found out so he can still get help. Carl’s screams as the door closes, and the look of horror  and guilt on Quentin’s face as the door closes. Yet he stays and listens to Carl’s screams, even as guilt stricken as he is, rather than following his usual pattern of running like hell and drowning the horror in booze. There’s so many levels of character development there for both characters, with both actors having the skill and ability to make the most of their character’s reactions.

Our next scene is Quentin cornering Magda in the Old House.  NOW he knows enough to recognize vampire marks – or a lack thereof.  Magda ends up playing a wild card and asking Angelique for help.  Amusing thing is she asks Ang to do what Barn himself should have been able to do – make Carl forget what he saw.  But Ang has has enough of hauling Barn’s bacon out of the fire and says no.  He has to learn that he DOES need her. (And she’s got an excellent point – a lot of Barn’s troubles come from ignoring her and he’s only escaped unscathed cause she saved him).

Carl in the mausoleum marking time, and panicking.   LOL love the part where he bangs on the coffin in frustratin, then is terrified he woke the vamp.  Then a little voice tells him to think logically and try to reason out how the door works, like one of his Chinese puzzles.  And he finds the latch (If I remember he’s the only one discovered on his own how to do that).  He escapes and flips out in hysterics and darn near pulls over the Styrofoam gravestone in the process.

Jeannie


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Offline alwaysdavid

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2009, 04:17:42 AM »
 Once again the quick working stone mason of Collinsport has worked his magic. I see that Angelique is strong enough to move the grave marker as she swishes by.   
It was interesting that Quentin thought Laura made Dirk a vampire.  Barnabas should have pushed this theory to eveyone.
"Curiosity killed the Carl" was a great line. 
you know there's a whole wing that's closed off all the time; the west wing, I go there lots of times

Offline MagnusTrask

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2009, 04:38:35 AM »
Jeannie, your posts just keep getting better and better.  I love this last one.
"One can never go wrong with weapons and drinks as fashion accessories."-- the eminent and clearly quotable Dark Shadows fan and board mod known as Mysterious Benefactor

Offline Taeylor Collins

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2009, 01:04:30 AM »
Off Topic:  I am gonna have to go over to TV.com and check out this Blake 7 everyone keeps talking about.  Is it on DVD? 
On Topic:  I enjoy your posts as well Jeannie.  And I agree with Trask, that one was particularly intriguing!
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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2009, 02:19:28 PM »
Thanks for the compliments on the post, guys!  There was just so much to work with in that episode.

Taeylor, bad news on the Blake's 7 front.  If you looked it up, you found out its a UK series.  It's similar to both Who and DS in that it's got excellent scripts, good actors, and sets and effects worth maybe $1.98.  Unfortunately thanks to our friends at the Beeb, it hasn't been seen on US public TV in years, and has only been released on DVD in VERY OVERPRICED region 2 disks,though it was released years ago on many many vhs tapes.  It's very annoying to US fans, trust me. Most of us have tapes recorded off public tv in the early 90s or earlier, and it's getting to the point where they MUST be moved  to dvd since every time you play them you're risking something irreplaceable.

Jeannie



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Offline MagnusTrask

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2009, 05:04:40 PM »
I agree with Trask, that one was particularly intriguing!

I'm now absorbing the fact that I have now been addressed simply as "Trask"!   Taeylor, re Blake's Seven, the myth, the legend, the agony, the ecstasy, the fanfic sexual playground, yes damn you you must see it.   By the way Jeannie, one night I figured out Avon, then it slipped out of my head and it never came back.  On the B7 board I was on for years someone else said the same thing happened to him!  

Jeannie, do you know about a cool B7 board with smart spirited people?   Really, I need to talk B7.   The old board I was on just dissipated into nothing then disappeared altogether.   For novices, I'll just say that if you enjoy wading hip-deep into the kind of character discussion we have here about DS, you've got your joyful work cut out for you with B7.   Another thing DS and B7 have in common: the character stuff isn't spelled out, or spoon-fed to you.   They dump viewers into the deep-end (much as in life), and demand that you form your own conclusions.
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Offline dom

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2009, 05:44:57 PM »
A friendly reminder/suggestion:

DS Forums guideline #8. Off-topic posts are allowed but should be so labeled and should be kept to a minimum.

Sorry to be a bore, but there's a whole lotta Blake's 7 talk going on. As a moderator I do have to read every word of every post, and this is a DS Forum. IMHO a lot of this OT could be discussed off-board via PM's.


Offline Taeylor Collins

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2009, 09:33:14 PM »
It's quite okay dom and I understand completely! :)
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Offline MagnusTrask

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2009, 09:40:09 PM »
Understood dom.   
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Offline Midnite

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2009, 06:00:12 AM »
Quentin to Magda:  "You visited with your tribes, and you compared notes on picking pockets and the newest way in telling fortunes, and you exchanged your secrets of all your curses and you all laughed."
Sounds exactly like all my DS Fest trips. ...
I kid!!!!!

Quentin to Carl:  "Remember, I can do it with one hand while the gun is in the other."
 ;D

Since Magda has already informed Quentin that the relic she stole will remove his curse at the next full moon, and she claimed to be willing to perform the ceremony for no other reason than that Jenny loved him, why does he still consider Barnabas to be his "only hope"?  What could Quentin expect to get out of sacrificing his brother to save Barnabas?  Once he's free of the curse, wouldn't he just leave with Beth?

I don't like Angelique's hairdo.  For one thing, she needs to lose the bun.  Her style was much prettier when she first showed up in 1897.

Once again the quick working stone mason of Collinsport has worked his magic.

LOL  It seems he put all his energies into the stone's face, not bothering to finish its edges at all.  But considering Rachel's mostly miserable life, the bird in flight was a nice touch.

We pick up with a new scene in which we find out that Barn is moving his digs back to the mausoleum...

Hmm, I believe you skipped an ep, P.  (See the previous ep for the better of the two scenes, IMO.)  Barnabas really should listen to Magda when she has one of her bad feelings, yes?

Quote
The more Angie keeps trying to warn Barn of what will go wrong, the more I think we’re dealing with both of them being time travelers.  He is bumbling around trying to piece it together and fix things, but she seems to KNOW exactly what will go wrong and keeps trying to give him warnings – which, being Barnabas, he promptly discounts/ignores.
I really like this scene between them.  You can really see Angie’s pov – and why she’s so upset, even hurt.  Apparently she’s been trying to be helpful, but every time it gets thrown in her face.  He’s not even willing to TRY and trust her, not once – even the times when he has nothing to lose by doing so.  So, she's hit the point of the heck with him, I give up, make a mess without my help  then try and get OUT of it without my help.

My take is that Ang was making up stories about his time running out to get him to return to the present with her-- because it was what SHE wanted.  But the timing of her appearance here could not have been worse.  Since he seems to blame the curse for Rachel's death-- a curse the witch carefully worded to include the death of everyone who loved him-- she has a lot of nerve showing up while he's mourning at her grave, so I think it makes sense that he'd rebuff her.  Sorry, I just don't feel the least bit bad for her.

Quote
Once the pieces slip together, Quentin sobers up real quick, and his brain kicks into action.

I love that as soon as his expression changed, we get a big Bum to start the music.

Quote
OK something just hit me.  If he knows enough of the basic Vampire lore that he repeats in this scene, HOW did he NOT recognize the bite marks on Beth’s neck?

Because no one suspected a vampire then?

Quote
(And she’s got an excellent point – a lot of Barn’s troubles come from ignoring her and he’s only escaped unscathed cause she saved him).

In 1796, [spoiler]Angelique made a deal with Barnabas that if he remained in that time with her (she was stuck there; he wasn't), she would save Vicki from hanging.  He agreed.  And the result was that Vicki was not only hanged but very nearly buried alive.[/spoiler] Angie's first reappearance in this world after that unfortunate incident was in this time (her timeline goes 1796 ---> 1897).  So if I were Barnabas, I'd want nothing more than the privilege of ignoring her too.

Quote
And he finds the latch (If I remember he’s the only one discovered on his own how to do that).

Oh yes, Carl stumbled on the latch while in a panic, something that David no-lock-can-stop-him Collins could not manage despite spending a full night plus several more hours in the secret room, sometimes even resting his head on the freakin' step.

And I hope you know that you can use the milestone smiley anytime you wish.  :)

Offline EmeraldRose

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2009, 12:01:50 PM »
Major Milestones: [milestone]
1. Quentin is back, after a two week absence! [luv] There was no explanation about where he was, either.
2. As Jeannie mentioned, Carl was the first person to discover on his own how to open the latch inside the Secret Room in the Mausoleum. Midnite is right, Jeannie - you can feel free to post milestones. You won't be infringing on my territory. [ghost_wink]
3. Barnabas refused to go back to the present time with Angelique. She then was so fed up with Barnabas that she refused when Magda asked her to help him.
4. Carl saw Barnabas open the secret panel, went inside, and found Barnabas in his coffin. Carl then told Quentin what he saw.
5. Quentin thought that Barnabas was his "only hope". After finding Barnabas in his coffin, Quentin pulled a gun on Carl and locked him in the Secret Room, knowing that Barnabas would probably kill him - his own brother! [shkdg]
6. Magda, refusing to tell Quentin the reason why she wanted to help him, told him that she thought the hand would cure him.

VO: Lara Parker

OH CRAP!  They give away the fact that we are gonna see Angelique in this episode. That is slightly annoying, but oh well!
Actually, Taeylor, I have a different take on that. Whenever I hear someone who hasn't been on for a while do the voiceover, I think that it's great! It's a pleasant surprise for me and makes me look forward to seeing that person in the episode. I particularly love it when I hear LP's voiceover, because she went for long periods of time without being on the show.  I thought to myself, "Oh, boy! Angelique's back!" [cheer]

It was amusing when Angelique moved the tombstone as she walked by, and Carl really moved the cross during the last scene! I also was amused when Quentin thought it was Laura who changed Dirk into a vampire! [ghost_cheesy]

It was great when Carl was locked in the Secret Room and figured out how to unlock the door. Karlen really does crazy well! I loved the following line from Carl: "We'll get him tonight! We'll get Cousin Barnabas tonight!" Gave me goosebumps! That look in his eyes was really priceless!

I think Quentin wasn't thinking straight. Magda had just told him that she would help him with the hand. So Barnabas was not his only hope! [ghost_nowink] However, I can see how Quentin would relate to Barnabas because they both were supernatural beings who could not control themselves.

Excellent episode! Fantastic acting by all! [clap2]

----- Sally -----
[snow_bigglass] [hippy2]
----- Sally -----
[snow_bigglass] [hippy2]

Offline Lydia

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2009, 02:05:19 AM »
Reasonable looking gravestone for  a governess, and we find out that Rachel was born in 1876 and died at 21.
That gravestone sort of got to me.  21 years with so very little happiness in them!

I was fed up with both Barnabas and Angelique during the cemetery scene.  Barnabas was acting as though he had made a smashing success so far of his visit to 1897 and as though he had not changed the past in any way (standing right next to Rachel's grave he believes this!) and Angelique was acting as though she had always - always! - had Barnabas's best interests foremost in her mind.

Quentin and Carl make an odd couple: Quentin tall, wearing a frock coat, and Carl short, looking like Little Lord Fauntleroy.  I'm not sure exactly what Little Lord Fauntleroy wore, but never mind.  And I never think Willie Loomis is short - but Carl looks as though he's probably wearing lifts in his shoes to make it above 5'3".

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Re: Discuss - Ep #0779
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2009, 04:42:04 AM »
Great post Lydia.  I agree on Rachel's short unhappy life. Very much like something out of Dickens, or Jane Eyre's schoolchum Helen.

LOL on Barn and Ang during that cemetary scene. Both of them were so wrapped up in their self absorbed delusions.

I love the image of Carl as Lord Fauntleroy.  As I found out by accident when I was researching some fanfic a few years ago, its too late for the kid Carl and Quentin (real shame; I just love the idea of those little devils in the fancy suits, with that LOOK that little boys get when shoehorned into cute fancy dress for photos) but fits great for the adult Carl (1880- to 1920s).  Think its the velvet jacket and his general kid attitude gives the impression.  I'd never noticed it before, but you're right: Karlen DOES somehow appear shorter as Carl than he does any other character.  Going by my (admittedly faulty) memory, I think I remember Desmond and Quentin I appearing to be very close to the same height.

Jeannie

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