Discuss - Ep #0729

Robservations #729

I'm glad the voiceover acknowledges that supernatural happenings were commonplace at that time because it sure seems like 1897 Collinwood was located on a Hellmouth.

Denise Nickerson can grate on my nerves

And this ep offers so many opportunities for it!  Can you say over-emoting?  I wonder if the director encouraged Denise's over-the top acting and facial expressions because they're especially annoying throughout this ep.

And yeah, I'm quoting myself.  Sad.

I realize that Nora was a bit late at crossing the landing, but that was an agonizingly slow march up the steps by Edward and Beth while a child was screaming upstairs.

We've now seen Beth (and earlier, Dirk) charged with Nora's care the same number of times that we've seen Rachel taking care of her.  We know that Rachel is doing her job and that the children need and favor her because we're TOLD these things, but we're shown little evidence of it; IIRC, we've seen her interact with each child only once... When she told Jamison that Quentin was dead, I think it was [spoiler]their only shared scene.[/spoiler]And the next time we'll see Rachel with Nora, [spoiler]they'll both be stuck at Worthington Hall, and they won't be governess and charge anymore.[/spoiler]When you consider the many times Vicki was shown caring for and teaching David, you're reminded that these little details are casualties in the race to get a complicated story told.

If anyone cares, Barbara Brownell played Laura in the dream and also reached for Nora at the end.  She was simultaneously appearing on Broadway in "Play It Again Sam" with Jerry Lacy (and Diana Walker)... but without the hood, black gloves, and pretty bracelets.

Big milestone here for Q & Beth shippers.

Edward shows an entirely different side with Nora.  He's very sweet and patient.  Nice way of showing that he's got more than one dimension.

LOL Love the Quentin and Beth scene.  Very 30s movie.  They've been fencing for such a long time. Though this scene tells you something interesting for the period (especially in light of a discussion that I skipped past until I have time to do a response that won't go on and on forever with period minutia).  As obnoxious and overbearing, as Quentin can be, even giving rape overtones at times, he clearly DOES take no for an answer, or this scene would never exist.  If he'd gotten what he wanted (or was willing to take it by force), he wouldn't be bargaining to get her to sleep with him in return for not killing Jenny.

The scene is very revealing in terms of character development, especially if you factor in Victorian attitudes toward sex. His tomcatting around is pretty much spot on for his age and class, and the inference is that he brings his anonymous conquests to the cottage, and that they're mostly soiled doves like the yet to be seen Tessie Kincaid. They're there -- and know that they're there -- for a good time, no strings attached. Yet, interestingly enough, he flirts with, but doesn't try much else, with the respectable, and presumably inexperienced women he interacts with. Oddly, that's considered appropriate behaviour, like Edward VII, who would only consort with married women, because he wouldn't be responsible for "ruining" a woman. But with Beth, we see something more developing, to the point where I think he gets tangled in his own web and starts falling in love with her.

 For her part, giving in to him immediately and irreversably brands her as "ruined"  -- a whore by Victorian standards, and, discounting what she knows about the family secrets, it's pretty certain that normally she would probably be fired on the spot, no references, no way to make a living but the streets.  Its a huge risk, all dependent on Quentin the pathological liar keeping his word.

On the one hand we have Quentin, who seems to enjoy the chase and the seduction, who would probably go into this as a game of seduction. And Beth, a respectable, unless a widow inexperienced, woman, who would probalby have the typical Victorian ignorance of sex as anything but an unpleasant duty. Interesting to think how the emotions here would play out, and how it will affect their interactions going forward.

Now, what WOULD that make this milestone?  First kiss, or first implied nookie? 

Jeannie

And yeah, I'm quoting myself.  Sad.

Not sad at all.  Always quote from the best!

I'm shocked at what Quentin will do to get satisfy his lust.  Jenny killed Quentin, and it made perfect sense for him to make sure that she wouldn't kill him again.  And he's apparently thrown that option away.  Or else he has no intention of keeping his end of his bargain with Beth - but apparently he plans to keep it, because he made that gratuitous announcement to Edward that he wasn't looking for Jenny anymore.  Maybe, however, as time goes by, the memory of being stabbed by Jenny is becoming blurred, as memories of painful things do.

Watching Nora going overboard about her mother, I wondered what she remembered of Jenny.  It seems plausible to me that one of Jenny's few pleasures at Collinwood, back in the days before she lost her marbles, would have been playing with Nora, but Nora never mentions her, never asks if Aunt Jenny will ever be coming back.  Poor Jenny, hidden away and forgotten.

Edward shows an entirely different side with Nora.  He's very sweet and patient.  Nice way of showing that he's got more than one dimension.

Yes, but I wish I believed in that extra dimension a little more.  It just doesn't ring true to me.  Maybe if I heard that he had brought a doll home for her, I would believe in the extra dimension.

Aww, Lydia, you are sweet.

I'm glad the voiceover acknowledges that supernatural happenings were commonplace at that time because it sure seems like 1897 Collinwood was located on a Hellmouth.

LOL!!  I love it.  ME and my brother and a friend just finished Episode 4 of the final Buffy season last night and we are watching Angel parallel with it, which is nice cause they compliment one another.  I am sharing it with them....but enjoying the second go around......

On Topic:  Sorry to get off!  Yeah that was a cool acknowledge, I agree!  It really worked well.  Little did we know when Victoria escorted us into this world we would meet all manor of supernatural creatures!

Quentin and Beth kissed each other for the first time in this episode. Also, it was the first time Quentin told her he wanted to have sex with her. I hope my lateness in posting this was worth the wait!  I love that scene between them. So romantic when they were thisclose to kissing, and then they did kiss! 

Quentin took the money out of Beth's purse, but gave it back to her. He was softening towards her, and I agree that he was starting to fall in love with her. I think that Beth had been in denial about being in love with Quentin for quite some time.

I enjoyed watching Nora's dream. It was cute to watch Edward ripping up the huge picture and saying, "Gone forever! Never coming back! Never coming back!" It seemed more like the way Carl would act, instead of Edward. Very against type. Reminded me a little bit of "Alice in Wonderland". 

Some people might have thought it was overacting on DN's part, but I really liked it when Nora froze with that expression on her face when Laura touched her. It was very dramatic. 

I got a kick out of watching Nora so easily slip outside the door without being seen by Quentin and Edward. They were so engrossed in their conversation that they weren't aware of their surroundings.

----- Sally -----

Slipping out the front door without being noticed is a family trait in this family. 

I mean, how many times have we seen David do it, especially in the first year of the show alone? Too many to count.

Quentin is no dummy. He's not gonna say "I want you Beth, but I'm still gonna kill Jenny once I find her." Making a deal with
Beth was his only shot with her in his mind...whether or not he intended to keep his word, I don't know. He was so anxious to kill Jenny and remove a serious threat to his life...

I adore Denise Nickerson. She may get on others' nerves, but I find her such a sweet child. Love that dream. I agree Edward acted so out of character in the dream, but it was a welcome relief from his usual pompousness. There's only one
other time he breaks out of character and that's when [spoiler] Jamison, possessed by Count Petofi, kisses him on the cheek, leading Edward to believe he's a servant. [/spoiler]