Author Topic: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02  (Read 6181 times)

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Offline Gothick

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2008, 09:59:05 PM »
I know this is really trivial, but looking at Taeylor's ravishingly fabulous captures of Barbara Steele's big scene, I'm remembering that her lipstick seemed WAY too loud to me this last time I watched my videotape of this episode.  Just off the hook.  Maybe it's because otherwise, her look is restrained and what one would expect of a "brilliant blood specialist by day, icy and aloof dominatrix by night" kinda gal.

I also found Barnabas' makeup in the eighteenth century sequences to be so garish, it frequently distracted me from what was going on (and there was a HELL of a lot going on).  Maybe I'll comment on that when you get to those shows, if Taeylor is still kind enough to post his captures--I no longer own tapes of any but the first two episodes.

G.

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2008, 10:10:25 PM »
Right off the top I'll admit that this is not my favorite ep of the series. It's not that I dislike it - I don't. In fact, I think it has much going for it. However, for me it's not as engaging as much of the rest of the series because far too much of it is a retread of DC's past projects - and DC is apparently blatantly unapologetic about it because he "borrows" or perhaps attempts to "pay homage" to (I don't know which) his past work with shot for shot restagings of it. I've lamented this in the past, so it will come as no surprise to long-time readers of the forum, but to me it certainly seems as if DC's motto was "If it worked once, use it again and again and again and..." What the man obviously failed to realize, though, was that might work for audiences unfamiliar with his work, but it's a huge disservice to those who are because they don't even have to actually watch to know what the next shot will be and what it will lead to afterward. I mean, OMG - as an example, just watch Ep #2 and then watch DC's version of Dracula - some of the similarities will be beyond striking.  [sad3]  And the reason I say DC was blatantly unapologetic about it is because he actually screened his past work looking for ways to incorporate it into this ep of the '91 series - and as I mentioned in the discussion for the second half of the pilot, Hall Powell and Bill Taub were hired specifically for that purpose...

The best thing to happen to the '91 series was that Linda Campanelli, Shelly Moore, Matt Hall and William Gray were brought on board after the miniseries eps were developed because, with both DC and Steve Feke having wanted blood, gore and violence to predominate, and with DC's preference for all of that over character, it's quite sad to think what the '91 series might have been had DC and Feke had their way unchallenged.

All that being said, though - what is fascinating is that when it comes to reviews of the miniseries that expressed a preference for one night over the other, several picked the second night (meaning Eps #2 and #3) over the first (meaning the pilot). I can perhaps see that when it comes to Ep #3 (though that discussion is for next week), but to me it's not really the case with Ep #2. But then, we're probably talking about reviewers who were not so familiar with DC's work as to recognize the shot for shot restagings for what they were. So, unlike me and others like me, they saw Ep #2 with an unclouded perspective.

And while we're on the subject of downsides - though this has nothing to do with the ep itself - it struck me again how unfortunate it is for those who are only able to see the series on DVD - particularly when it comes to the actors' close-ups. So much can be conveyed in a close-up - but with a full quarter of the original framing completely missing in Sony's misguided effort to falsely create a widescreen appearance, too much of their work can often go unseen...

But enough of the downside, let's focus on the interesting aspects of this ep:

I love how Chuy Elizondo's cinematography picks up seamlessly from Dietrich Lohmann's work in the pilot.

Even though the romantic relationship between Vicki and Barnabas isn't really touched on in this ep, it's interesting that they made a point of showing Vicki doodling Josette's name on a pad to establish that it isn't far from Vicki's mind.

There's no avoiding the fact that this series wholly embraces the vampire bite as sex act. I remember that at the time the series was in production DC often commented in interviews that it was his intent to play up the sex angle and he was pleased whenever women in the screening room swooned because he knew they'd gotten it right. Well, they certainly went full tilt for the orgasmic angle - and there's probably no better example of that than in this ep when it comes to Michael T. Weiss and his ecstatic eye fluttering as Daphne attacks him.

And while we're still in that vein, Joe must have really been drained for him not to have shown any sign of movement for so long. I mean, there's definitely one type of movement that virtually every male in Joe's age range displays when he's sleeping and it's completely involuntary. But perhaps Joe's blood supply had yet to be fully recouped for that particular movement to take place.

It's amazing where a certain characterization may set one's mind to wondering. For example, does anyone besides me suspect that if Carolyn had been in Daphne's place, and it was she who needed Joe and Deputy Harker to "look after her," the men wouldn't have been taking turns merely reading in a chair - there may have been a full-fledged menage a trois going in that room!

I definitely get a kick out of how Willie hides his face as Julia opens Barnabas' coffin.

I love Julia's smile at the end of the ep - everything is falling completely into place for her.

And finally, there have been a few remarks that Barnabas doesn't seem sympathetic, but I don't honestly think he's actually supposed to be at this point. I mean, what has he done to elicit much sympathy? Beating and killing don't exactly make for sympathetic acts. But characters can be interesting, even fascinating, without being sympathetic. Plenty of such characters exist. Personally, even at this point I find Barnabas eminently watchable - particularly in a What-Will-He-Do-Next sort of way (even when, thanks to DC, I have some idea of what he's going to do). And the thing is that this ep is only the third installment in a thirteen installment story arc. In a well thought out arc, characters evolve over time and through circumstance and experience. Barnabas will be no different - particularly once the Campanelli, Moore, M. Hall and Gray (and John Boorstin) team become involved.

Offline Gothick

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2008, 10:44:04 PM »
MB, your comments about Joe Haskell's lack of "involuntary" movement while sleeping gave me quite a giggle.  Thanks for the fun--it 's been a rather draggy weekend otherwise.

Am I imagining it or is there a scene coming up where we get to see Michael T. Weiss naked from behind?  Ah, a charming county Derry Air *wink*

G.

Offline Taeylor Collins

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2008, 08:43:14 AM »
I will be screen caputring pictures from ever ep! :)  And I LOVED YOUR POST MB! It was nice to see a full review.  I know you don't have time for this stuff often but thank you.  I am hoping tomorrow! 
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Offline KMR

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2008, 08:00:23 PM »
And while we're on the subject of downsides - though this has nothing to do with the ep itself - it struck me again how unfortunate it is for those who are only able to see the series on DVD - particularly when it comes to the actors' close-ups. So much can be conveyed in a close-up - but with a full quarter of the original framing completely missing in Sony's misguided effort to falsely create a widescreen appearance, too much of their work can often go unseen...

I actually cancelled my preorder of the DVD set on Amazon when word first came out that it was in widescreen.  But I finally bought a copy a few months ago when I found it at Target for $20 (with a "free" copy of DARK ANGEL Season 1 thrown in).

I'm now sorry I didn't go ahead and buy it earlier, because truthfully it is not nearly as bad as everyone makes it out to be (well, at least in my opinion...)  I haven't watched the MPI tapes or my off-the-air tapes from the original broadcast in many, many years.  But except for a small handful of shots, the widescreen cropping actually creates a pleasing composition.  It's almost like it was originally shot with the intention of using a widescreen matte on the image.  Only a few closeups are just a bit too tight, throughout the entire series.  The vast majority of shots look like correctly framed widescreen shots.

The complaints about the day-for-night shots, however, are right on the mark.  One remedy for that is to just take it for granted that super-intense moonlight (no matter what phase the moon is in) is normal in this parallel universe where Maine has palm trees.  Sit back and enjoy...

Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2008, 09:24:13 PM »
Sadly, though, the series was never meant to be seen with the framing cropped the way it is on the DVD set with a full quarter of the original 4:3 standard aspect ratio cropped off. And what's really galling is that HD 16:9 widescreen masters do indeed exist for the '91 series. They and not the framing on the DVDs are the way the series was designed to be seen in widescreen - and they would have added fully a third of extra, never before seen image to every frame - but Sony, in their ultimate insanity, chose to butcher the 4:3 masters rather than use the 16:9 masters for the DVD transfer.

And for those who may have missed it the first time around, here's how Darren explained what was mistakenly done to the scene from this ep between Daphne and Barnabas:
The color problem is essentially this: several scenes that were shot day-for-night (ie: during the day, but with filters used and an effort to avoid shadows cast by the sun, and tweaking in the film color-timing later) and are supposed to have a somewhat dim, heavily bluish look to them, to simulate night-time sequences. The tech services department that color-timed the HD transfers, were clearly unaware of how the day-for-night sequences are supposed to look and made them look as if they occur in broad daylight, on a sunny afternoon. So, you'll have a sequence where Daphne gets up from her bed and leaves the room at night (studio filmed) and meets and is bitten by Barnabas on a nice, sunny day.

Incidentally, a few clips of what the Daphne/Barnabas scene is supposed to look like can be seen in the preview video in this post:
Previews

Offline michael c

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #21 on: September 29, 2008, 10:02:48 PM »
nelson brings up an intersting point that i never would have thought about...embalming.

through the process of embalming isn't all the blood drained from the deceased and their internal organs removed?wouldn't this remove the potential for the,shall we say undead,to crave additional blood?also since the vampire angle was already dangling about at the time of daphne's death why wasn't she cremated?

and as nelson mentioned,why was a newly created tomb already covered in cobwebs?

as i said before i find the plotting of this to be mystifying.what was dan curtis going for exactly?except for that "other" show i'm unfamiliar with vampire lore.i've never seen 'buffy' or 'angel' or anything.but isn't it typical that an air of mystery surrounds the goings on for awhile before the presence of vampires is revealed towards the climax?in other vampire tales is it typical for everyone to know about it so early on?this doesn't seem to leave alot of places to go.

i'm going to try to phrase this carefully because "this" show has provided us with such sketchy outlines i'm watching and going on alot of assumptions that i'm not sure have actually been spelled out for us here.

for instance,i'm watching under the assumption that victoria winters is an orphan uncertain of her identity and thus is traveling to collinsport to get information.however except for a few words that imply that during her opening voiceover has that been spelled out here?is it established that liz and roger are siblings or am i just assuming that because i know the story?i'm assuming that family's wealth comes from the ownership of a cannery and other fishing enterprises but is that even suggested here?who is carolyn's father and why are there so few servants in this place?i'm filling in all those blanks,again,because i'm so familiar with this story as a whole but what did new viewers to this series think about these things?
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #22 on: September 29, 2008, 10:29:31 PM »
In general terms from my experience I'd say it's never good to assume anything that hasn't been established on screen in some way - in fact it can often be dangerous.  ;)

As far as Elizabeth and Roger being brother and sister goes, as Midnite pointed out, one specific reference so far to that was cut from the NBC airing (and thus the DVD), though it was restored on the MPI VHS. (I'm not even sure it's been established that Elizabeth is David's aunt.  [hdscrt]) But as to what personal info we may learn down the line about any of the characters or the family, it's been so long since I've watched the '91 series that I don't honestly remember...

i've never seen 'buffy' or 'angel' or anything.but isn't it typical that an air of mystery surrounds the goings on for awhile before the presence of vampires is revealed towards the climax?

Certainly not on Buffy or Angel or even any other vampire themed series in recent memory. The existence and involvement of real vampires is established from pretty much the get go.

Offline Gothick

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #23 on: September 29, 2008, 10:52:21 PM »
As I think MB commented in an earlier post, the pacing of the story in the early episodes of this show mirrors the pacing in some other DC ventures, notably hoDS and the Jack Palance Dracula movie.  Not just the pacing, but in some cases whole stretches of dialogue and shot set-ups were copied near-verbatim from those earlier works.

I think by 1990-91, the vampire genre had reached a point where the old structure that was exploited so brilliantly in earlier shows--of having suspense building around a series of mysterious attacks and an undiagnosed "illness" suffered by a heroine--ultimately traced back to the chapters of Dracula about Lucy's "illness"--was perceived as no longer really working.  Besides hoDS, in 1970 the feature film Count Yorga, Vampire quickly established that vampires were on the loose, and the "theme" of the movie was not so much one of suspense as horror created by a sequence of luridly constructed vampire set-pieces.  This re-tooling of the genre had been pioneered by Hammer studios in their early films (Horror of) Dracula, Brides of Dracula, and Kiss of the Vampire. 

Between the early 1970s and 1990, you had the explosion of the Anne Rice phenomenon, as well, which radically changed the face of the gothic vampire genre.  So, bear that in mind when evaluating these shows.

From what little I have read about the behind the scenes stuff at NBC,  when it came to the horror quotient in the story, the studio suits wanted more, faster, harder.  Dan Curtis never needed much encouragement to up the ante in the "blood, carnage and fangs" department.  (Or, as Grayson once said lovingly, "Dan has a real genius for SPOOK.")

I look forward to the critique of the next episode--if memory serves (my single viewing of it was on VHS ca. 1997), they REALLY let the blood spatter in that one.

G.

Offline michael c

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #24 on: September 29, 2008, 11:13:13 PM »
i'm still confused on this point.

i realize that in most modern vampire tales that we,the viewer,and certain key characters know from the outset of the existence of vampires.

but does absolutely everyone know about them.the way this series has been set up by episode three everyone in collinsport knows all about them.information that would presumably get out to the rest of the world instantly.

my only other experience with shows that dealt with the supernatural or paranormal was the "x-files" and generally it was just mulder,scully and a few others who were "on" to the exact nature of the proceedings.the rest of the world remained,in effect,outside the know.

that's why this series has me so puzzled.i don't understand the way it's plotted at all.
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #25 on: September 29, 2008, 11:20:44 PM »
but does absolutely everyone know about them.the way this series has been set up by episode three everyone in collinsport knows all about them.information that would presumably get out to the rest of the world instantly.

The thing is, and it most often seems to be the same regardless of the show, many if not most of the people in the location where the vampires exist know of them or soon know of them, but the location seems to remain its own world cut off from the rest of the world, so the rest of the world doesn't know about them.

Offline Taeylor Collins

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #26 on: September 29, 2008, 11:32:05 PM »
In 1991 a I instantly knew Roger and Elizabeth were brother and sister.  I knew Carolyn was here daughter. I just figured Victoria was hired and they the reason she came was because they were probably paying her an enormous salary!!   I really had no problem following it! However that is just me.  I had never experienced TV like this in my 14 years.  No TV show EVER captured me like Dark Shadows did! :)   I guess since I wasn't exposed to a lot of vampire shows (were there any?) or Dan's work on Dracula or other movies  my consciousness or unconsciousness had nothing to compare it to.  And to be quite frank, I think I am glad for that.  I retract my wish being around in the 60's 70's, although I would travel there if we're offered a sojourn through time!!  I am sure DS came along at a time in my life when it was supposed to and the stars were aligned!!

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #27 on: September 29, 2008, 11:43:53 PM »

And here are the commercial bumpers for Ep #2 that give a peek at what's to come in the next act:

[video]
<a href="http://www.dsboards.com/1991/0114_Bumper_1.swf" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.dsboards.com/1991/0114_Bumper_1.swf</a>

(To control the play of the video, right-click on it and use the controls.)
[/video]

[video]
<a href="http://www.dsboards.com/1991/0114_Bumper_2.swf" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.dsboards.com/1991/0114_Bumper_2.swf</a>

(To control the play of the video, right-click on it and use the controls.)
[/video]

(More to come...)

Offline michael c

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #28 on: September 30, 2008, 12:04:18 AM »
thanks mysterious,

i'm genuinely not trying to be difficult.i'm just unfamiliar with shows of this nature.

on a high note i really like julia,carolyn and maggie quite alot.the more i see the more i like.
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Offline Mysterious Benefactor

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Re: Discuss: '91 Series - Ep #02
« Reply #29 on: September 30, 2008, 12:10:12 AM »
i'm genuinely not trying to be difficult.

I didn't think you were.  [ghost_smiley]

I guess seemingly mostly every character knowing that real vampires exist is just an accepted premise in most vampire shows nowadays - and to someone who doesn't follow them, I can see where that might be surprising.