Discuss: '91 Series - Pilot - Part 1

the scene where daphne is walking to her car looked very fake to me.the grass was too green and glossy.perhaps "soundstage" was not the right word but to me it looked like a set.

Actually, that entire sequence was shot outdoors on the Columbia Ranch. 

the dry ice doesn't help.

That effect was created with smoke, not dry ice. Barbara Steele even joked that the entire cast would probably need Iron Lungs by the time the series wrapped. 

oh..

and i guess having 'vampires' mentioned in the pilot bugs because the proper sense of mystery and suspense is not being established.i prefer a slower buildup.it's too quick.

having people 'on' to the main mystery twenty minutes into series is hasty storytelling to me.but that's just my opinion.

As far as the vampire issue goes, the writers felt that the audience for the show would be much too sophisticated/aware to string along. But even at that, it's not like anyone in the first part of the pilot suspects a real vampire. Prof. Woodard merely tells Sheriff Patterson that there are "unbalanced people" who believe themselves to be vampires - not that they're actual vampires.

My 666th post!

Okay, one of the frustrating things is that there are some characters that I suspect will become more prominent and I have no idea who they are.

Just about everyone else gets a name but who is the doctor that treats Daphne?  Hiram?  Same with the man Sheriff Patterson visits.  Based on what we've seen so far, I don't recall his name being used nor really what the heck Patterson was doing there in the first place.  What is their relationship?  Based on the dialogue, it seems that Patterson goes to this guy when confronted with a case outside the mainstream, which would indicate to me that Collinsport is an occasional hotbed of weird activity.  Yet nowhere else in the episode (prior to Barnabas' appearance) is there any indication that Collinsport is such a place.  If it were, then why does Sam let Daphne walk out of the Blue Whale alone at night without a second thought.  But Patterson goes to see this guy in the house with strange supernatural items all through it?  And thanks him with an "As always, thanks for your help" ?

I'm not intrigued by this yet, merely mildly annoyed that the writing here is a bit sloppy (IMHO, of course.)

Considering that you've already watched the whole pilot, you [spoiler]needn't worry too much about the doctor because you've already seen all you're ever going to see of him. But for the record, his name is Dr. Hiram Fisher. He was supposed to turn up in Ep #4, but his entire part landed up on the cutting room floor. More on that after we get to Ep #4...[/spoiler]

As for the man the sheriff goes to see, I believe the writers were being deliberately mysterious about him. All we explicitly learn from his first scene is that he's a professor. But from the paraphernalia around his house, we can deduce he's probably an anthropologist. And it's not unusual for the police to consult an anthropologist from time to time, particularly in cases involving unusual assailants. But as to the full extent of the relationship, we're left to wonder about that - and that isn't such a bad thing...

as i said i was just expressing an opinion...

but i still don't considering building suspense as being "strung along"...

nor do i consider myself to be "unsophisticated/unaware".

and i find the tone of these comments,whether intended or not,to be quite insulting.

I don't think the writers intended their comments to be insulting to their potential audience. Quite the opposite - I believe they were complimenting the audience's intelligence. The basic idea was that practically anyone coming to DS was already all too well aware that they were going to be seeing a vampire story, so what would actually be insulting to the audience would be to try to pretend in any way otherwise. They felt the audience would be too sophisticated and aware enough to spot a vampire story from a mile off when they saw one.

nor do i consider myself to be "unsophisticated/unaware".

Nor does anyone here.  MB is saying that a writing decision was made over what type of fans they wished to appeal to, and that was fans of vampire stories.  This is evident in the NBC promos that are on display, since they seem to stress the horror and vampire angles, which is a pity since the series could have reached an even larger audience had the pre-publicity acknowledged the Gothic romance theme as well, but I digress.

But I really want to make the point that, as in all board discussions about DS, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

midnite...
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i've lived in california and i've lived in maine.the play of the sunlight and the foliage are totally different.there's not mistaking that this was filmed in california.

OMG, I've never heard of that!  I misunderstood what you meant about the blazing sun, oops.

Since you're watching on DVD, I'm wondering if what you're also seeing is due to their lightening the print during the DVD transfer so that nighttime events appear to take place in bright sunlight; it certainly affects my enjoyment of certain scenes.  Barnabas should not be and was not in the woods at noon.  <sigh>

...indicate to me that Collinsport is an occasional hotbed of weird activity... If it were, then why does Sam let Daphne walk out of the Blue Whale alone at night without a second thought. 

This could be attributed to the fact that it has been awhile since the last "bizarre happening".  (With the inclusion of the word "occasional", you provided part of the solution to your question.)  It is a really common occurrence for people to return to having a false sense of security if something bad hasn't happened recently, but did a few months prior.  (I see it all the time.)  This, of course, is just me explaining away that part of your post, and has really little to do with much else, so pay no attention to the man behind the curtain... er... coffin!   

Thanks for bringing up the Carolyn and Joe thing.  I hadn't even noticed that and it is an interesting angle.   In one scene, an accidental shot of a window with the bright Calif sun shining in must have gotten past the editors...I could sit around and nit pick to death every little miscue and it might be fun to do sometime but my thinking is, a person seeing the show for the first time wouldn't have picked up on the mistakes.  There is a lot going on. Also, I can see a man like Roger who might dearly love his son, become so frustrated by his (David's) behavior, end of thinking that it would have been better off if the mother hadn't succombed to spare the child.  The Willie character is certainly very unusual in that he vascillates back an forth from being the village idiot to this really mean, nasty individual who probably blames everyone else for his misfortunes.  His character seems to go back and forth between those two extremes and I don't feel an ounce of empathy for him.

i realize that the audience for this show was obviously going to get the vampire angle from the get-go.

i was refering more to collinsport law enforcement and the townspeople getting wise to it too soon.that's why i was surpried to hear it referenced so quickly.

but frankly i feel rather bullied in this topic so this will be my last post in it.

oh hey, mscbryk don't go - i know i'm interested in reading your comments.

i thought the pilot got off to a good start. although i can see the seams - the quality of light is wrong and the buildings don't really look right for new england - they did an effective job of creating a creepy, gloomy mood.

i tend to go back and forth on some of the actors. willie is strange, and i don't get what's going on with his teeth. is this "british book of smiles" or something? he's alternately dumb and threatening, but i suspect that's the writing. jim fyfe manages to project some pathos into the role, and i think that's what vicki was reacting to when she agreed to get into the truck with him

it's strange that there's really no mention of victoria's background. what would cause a stunningly beautiful twenty-five-year-old woman of relative sophistication to chuck everything and head out for this small town to be a governess? seems like something out of a nineteenth century novel.

there isn't much going on to let us know who the collins family members are, either. elizabeth seems kind, but so far, the character is just a sketch. and there is no explanation as to why she has an english accent while roger sounds like any well bred man of his generation.

carolyn is just...weird. seems like she's tripping or high all the time. and i have to agree with whoever said upthread that there was even a scene in which it seemed like she wanted to seduce victoria.

they don't waste any time in getting to the vampire, do they? less than fifteen minutes in, and willie has already found his resting place. really liked the rhyme about the lion and the dove. why do you suppose that was written? did someone hope the vampire would eventually be found?

daphne is such a throwaway character. even though i think it is stated that she is a collins, she has "star trek red shirt" written all over her. when she was found after the attack i had to think "wow - that barnabas is a messy eater!" but then again, he must've been hungry after his 200 year fast!

two of the best actors so far (imho) are mrs. johnson and david. both are utterly believable. while it's strange that vicki isn't more put off by the little guy's hostility, it appears she won him over pretty fast. an aside - why are the family letting david play in the old house? wouldn't that be unsafe?

maybe i missed it, but was it ever explicitly stated where this is all taking place? the police car i saw in one scene may have had maine license plates, but i couldn't tell for sure.

it's odd to me that the collins family would just accept barnabas being who he claims to be at face value. i'd think they might run a background check on him - even given that he looks so like the portrait of his "ancestor." and did anyone notice the other portrait on the stairway next to his? it looked like marlon brando in "the godfather"!

really loved the look barnabas gave vicki when he first saw her - despite his restraint, it's clear that there is something more going on than him being bowled over by her beauty. and joanna going played her first encounter with the vampire just right: a hesitation/attraction combination mostly shown in her eyes and through body language.

can't wait for next week!

and i find the tone of these comments,whether intended or not,to be quite insulting.

I for one apologize for the harshness of my comment about tax fraud.  No disdain or insult was intended.  I simply did not see how you could read tax fraud into the playful banter of that scene, but even though you yourself dismissed the comment later, you put it out there.  It's only fair that others will remark on it.  (TBH, I'm surprised no one has blasted me for suggesting that Carolyn was trying to seduce Vicki ....  )

I agree with your observation that the building of suspense was perhaps compromised by introducing the idea of a vampire so early in the narrative.  I generally think that in places the writing of the pilot (though credited to I think four writer's, including DC) has DCs fingerprints all over it, and shows DC's willingness to sacrifice character and exposition and suspense, to "hurry up and get his vampire freak on."

Having said that, I'm okay with that to a certain extent.  Like my earlier comments about Willie, I like that Patterson and co. aren't defaulting to the most likely scenario and thinking outside the box.  At this point, their thinking outside the box amounts to a madman who thinks he's a vampire (because we all know real vampires don't exist).

[spoiler]Patterson also won more respect from me in an episode down the road, when he reveals that Barnabas has been his prime suspect pretty much all along, but that's for another week ....[/spoiler]

I hope that you will reconsider, and will be joining us for the rest of the project. 

Since you're watching on DVD, I'm wondering if what you're also seeing is due to their lightening the print during the DVD transfer so that nighttime events appear to take place in bright sunlight; it certainly affects my enjoyment of certain scenes.  Barnabas should not be and was not in the woods at noon.  <sigh>

Even though there are several topics that go into the horrors of how the DVD release was terribly botched by Sony, it can probably never be mentioned enough that anyone being exposed to the '91 series for the first time by watching it on DVD isn't getting the same experience as having watched it originally or on MPI's VHS release. For example, here's a side by side comparison of just a few moments from Daphne's walk to her car:

Original with filtering:	DVD with filtering mistakenly "corrected":

wow, that's a huge difference! thanks for posting those, mb.

a friend of mine taped the show on vhs during the original run. will be seeing him next weekend. perhaps we can watch an episode or two. i figured it couldn't just be that i remembered it looking more eerie the first time i saw it.

what can those idiots have been thinking in "cleaning" up the picture? destroys half of the creep factor.