Author Topic: DS on Gothlist  (Read 1945 times)

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Offline Midnite

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DS on Gothlist
« on: November 07, 2006, 06:45:25 PM »
From dailypress.com:

20 blackest moments in goth

Offline retzev

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2006, 09:09:10 AM »

Ugh  ::)  I shudder to think of our beloved soap-opera associated with the most ridiculous sub-culture of all time.

Embarrassing  :P


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Offline PennyDreadful

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2006, 05:35:10 PM »
 Actually, the early goth/Batcave scene in London was fretty freakin' cool.  That's back when the music was still firmly rooted in punk and glam (as a reaction against the increasingly violent and ostensibly prejudiced 'Sham 69 punks').  There were great bands like Specimen and early Siouxsie & the Banshees (who came directly out of the UK punk scene) and in the States there was 45 Grave whom I adore.  I think it veered off on a very lame path shortly thereafter, but it started out good.  It was rock 'n' roll and cobwebs and black lipstick.  It was fun.  The look was more tongue in cheek than anything - and back then it was shocking to see a teenager dressed like a punk rock corpse.  It was as underground as you could get.  It wasn't about being pretentious, depressed in the corner and listening to VNV Nation.  There are a few bands out there today who still have the early spirit of the thing going on (the Rabies are one I can think of off the top of my head), but a lot of the so-called "goth" stuff in the 90s was a load of electronic garbage.  A lot of the new kids who got into it were intolerably pretentious, acted like they were depressed and had no idea what actual goth music was.  People took themselves too seriously.  And it got much worse when people started calling Marilyn Manson goth.  Lately, I've noticed a trend with some bands going back toward the early deathrock style and attitude which is good I suppose.   

 Not that DS has much to do with it, other than feeding into the visual element as an iconic Gothic touchstone.

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Offline Gothick

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2006, 06:40:14 PM »
That column seems more about the author's cultural illiteracy than anything else.

The fact that Lugosi was laid out in his coffin in his vampire cape was a far more significant Goth element at his funeral than the mere fact of his death.  (In fact, a few years before on a television appearance, Lugosi had uttered the fateful words:  "Dracula never dies.")

No mention of Nick Drake, one of the great misbegotten bards cherished by the more intelligent segments of Gothiana (yes, they do exist).

No mention of Montague Summers, failed Roman Catholic Priest who stalked London in the late 1920s and early 1930s in a long black cape, almost invariably seen scowling over a huge blackbound volume of incunabula.

No mention of Vampira, aka Maila Nurmi, whose horror-host show in 1950s LA was the original definition of the Goth chick aesthetic.

Venus in Furs was an allusion to a novel by Leopold von Sacher-Masoch, the man who gave Masochism as a sexual fetish its name.

I would go on, but after awhile, what's the point?

cheers, GOTHICK.

Offline retzev

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2006, 06:52:22 PM »
I agree, Penny, some of the early stuff was cool, but the whole scene has been so lame for so long and has become such a part of mainstream culture that the whole thing just makes me sick. When I was a kid I had girlfriends who would be called Goths nowadays, and I loved their look and I dug a lot of the music too, but we never used or even heard the term "Goth" as far as I can remember. It was Deathrock. And you couldn't get your gear at the mall, they didn't sell "Goth" encyclopedias at Borders book-store...that's cool if some of the new bands want to go back to the old sounds, but...I don't know...


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Offline PennyDreadful

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2006, 07:28:57 PM »
That's just it Retzev, the whole thing was appropriated by the media and marketed to the Hot Topic kids.  The same things has happened with punk, and it looks like it's happening with psychobilly too. The early, simple deathrock/Batcave stuff is the "real" goth music to me. 

 Gothick, I agree with your comments above.  The article is not very good and excludes a lot, particularly when looking at the gothic aesthetic as a whole.

  
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Offline retzev

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2006, 07:41:18 PM »
Where the hell's Dave Vanian when you need him?
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Offline CastleBee

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2006, 08:37:38 PM »
Quote from: retzev
Ugh    I shudder to think of our beloved soap-opera associated with the most ridiculous sub-culture of all time.

Being waaaaay too old to have ever taken any of this at all seriously, I have to say there is something about the theatrical element of the whole thing that sort of fascinates me.  If nothing else, it's kind of entertaining...probably more so before it started to break down and become more main stream I'm sure.

And yeah, that article was a bit scattered - it seemed like the writer was pulling various events out of a hat.


Quote from: DailyPress
June 1966. Television series "Dark Shadows" debuts. This soap opera featured ghosts, werewolves and a 200-year-old vampire named Barnabas Collins. The mix of spookiness and heart-wrenching love-gone-wrong stories connects with teenagers.

Ahemmmmm, and pre-teens thank you very much. [hall2_wink]
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Offline arashi

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2006, 07:25:12 AM »
There were great bands like Specimen and early Siouxsie & the Banshees (who came directly out of the UK punk scene)

Ah! My Dad took my sister and I to see Siouxsie & the Banshees at the Orpheum in Boston for the Rapture tour. I am STILL pissed off that that was the ONE concert we ever went to that I didn't get a shirt. My Dad wouldn't buy us one unless my sister and I shared it, even though she didn't want one. I wonder if I could find one on e-bay......

But thanks for the link to the article! My Mom told me that back at the time DS aired, kids that were into "gothic" stuff were known as New Romantics.

Offline BuzzH

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2006, 03:55:36 PM »
My Dad wouldn't buy us one unless my sister and I shared it, even though she didn't want one. I wonder if I could find one on e-bay......

Well, why didn't you get one to share then?  If your sister didn't want one, she probably wouldn't have ever worn it and basically it would have been yours alone.  ;)
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Offline arashi

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Re: DS on Gothlist
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2006, 05:55:27 PM »
Well, why didn't you get one to share then?  If your sister didn't want one, she probably wouldn't have ever worn it and basically it would have been yours alone.  ;)

To this day I have no idea why! Even though my sister told him she didn't want one, he still wouldn't buy one unless we shared it. My parents spoil my sister and I rotten, even now, so I still have no idea why this logic held on that day.