Hello DSF, Professor Stokes Here!

"Could Jerry Lacy LOOK more like Bogey?"

I really think he could.  Or else, how could it happen that I just don't like Humphrey Bogart, but I love Jerry Lacy?

Welcome to the Forum, by the way.

Hi Professor Stokes!  Welcome to the DS Forums!

- Penny Dreadful

For many, certainly - but not for all of us. As I've posted many times before (so I'll keep this one brief  ), there are also fans who love the entire package that is DS - and as shocking as it may be to some, not only can we actually enjoy all the various plots that don't feature Barnabas, we can even imagine a DS that could have continued well past the point that Barnabas would have been written out. Many soaps have featured central characters on a par with the popularity of Barnabas and they've all managed to survive well past those characters' departures. Yes, the shows have often become very different from what they were when those characters were a part of them - but they have endured - and in most cases, even thrived afterward...


And welcome aboard, Professor Stokes! 

Thank you, mister admin (I sent you a PM, by the way).

In all fairness to the show, yes, it probably could have gone on without Barnabas. But we'll never know. It also could have fallen flat without him, never achieving the lofty status that it did ...doomed for cancellation. Who knows? But he stayed on the show, even during the time [spoiler]he was cured and wasn't biting anyone. You could say that was the period of his DS career when it was ...<ahem> ..."a fangless job" [/spoiler]

(That pun wasn't my fault - I was inspired by your calculus sig  )

Wow. Thanks again for all the warm welcomes! What a great forum!

Hi Professor Stokes
     I have to agree with MB.  However, I watched the show back in the 60s and loved Barnabas.  The days he wasn't on me and my friends would bail and go outside to play.  Rewatching the show as an adult, I can appreciate the other characters.  The members of the board discuss characters they like making me see the characters in a new light.  I now notice relationships more between Elizabeth and Roger, Barnabas and Willie, etc.  Thats why this board in so fascinating.  Cousins will point out subtle things I may have missed which makes the show that much more fun to watch again and again.

There are much more subtle nuances in the character development that we could have missed as kids, in fact probably did. I was like you - I felt cheated if Barnabas wasn't on that day. At the time it was like watching Bewitched without Samantha

I particularly like how the relationship between Barnabas and Julia has gradually developed. Remember early on they were mortal enemies - Julia only cooperated because she had to, and for the professional interest.

Which brings me to this question - How did Julia find the time to run Wincliff? She was always at Collinwood or the old house

I particularly like how the relationship between Barnabas and Julia has gradually developed. Remember early on they were mortal enemies - Julia only cooperated because she had to, and for the professional interest.

Which brings me to this question - How did Julia find the time to run Wincliff? She was always at Collinwood or the old house

I too enjoyed the way Barnabas and Julia grew gradually closer as the series progressed.

And as to your question, I have often wondered the same thing. 

Perhaps she used the time traveling staircase to go back a day, do her work at Windcliff, then return to the present. 

I particularly like how the relationship between Barnabas and Julia has gradually developed. Remember early on they were mortal enemies - Julia only cooperated because she had to, and for the professional interest.

Which brings me to this question - How did Julia find the time to run Wincliff? She was always at Collinwood or the old house

I too enjoyed the way Barnabas and Julia grew gradually closer as the series progressed.

And as to your question, I have often wondered the same thing.

Perhaps she used the time traveling staircase to go back a day, do her work at Windcliff, then return to the present. 

That Julia was crafty

This is likely my farewell post, and Bugsie's too. Such a short time ...... 

Unfortunately, the way the internet is nowadays, there are spammers who flood forums with junk, trying to hawk their wares forcefully. To defend against it, places like DSF have anti-flood timers in place that prevent posts too soon after the previous post. The timer prevents repeat posts from the same IP address. Well, we have DSL at home, and the whole household (5 PCs, wireless router and a common DSL line) has the same IP which is dynamically assigned by the ISP. There is no way to change that. My only other option would be to use dialup

That means that it is next to impossible for Bugsie and I to participate here because we likely would be on at the same time at many times during the day. Having that constant error message would take all the joy out of it. I've experienced it several times already.

It's a shame because we would probably have shot to the top of your posting ranks within a year because I personally have 28,000 posts on my forum, and Pam has about 24,000 We are no strangers to actively posting away, and we both expected to be very active here. But with that kind of anticipated activity from our IP, there's no way we could try to maneuver our posting here so as to avoid the timer, by assigning "your time to post" and "my time to post" It would be too frustrating for us. We have discussed it and we both agree.

While I have the anti-flood timers disabled on my own forum, and have had no trouble since all members must be activated by the admin before posting, I'm sure there are good reasons for having such a limitation here. I've already communicated my questions and feelings about this to Midnite, and Midnite has replied that this is an unavoidable feature that can't be disabled.

So, adios Dark Shadows Forums. It's been nice

I'll stop in a couple more times later to check PMs, in case Midnite finds a solution. I've got my fingers crossed

I think fans see DS as campy and enjoy it for the bloopers. This isn't exacty news nor is it a criticism.

 If that is true, it is unfortunate and something of a slap in the face to the actors and people behind the scenes who worked hard to create a serious supernatural series.

  I find it hard to believe that most fans are into the show for laughs.  I doubt the show has survived as long as it has because people get off on bloopers.  I think the more likely scenario is the old adage that the most negative voices are generally the loudest.  I think most DS fans watch it for the good writing, acting and atmosphere and forgive the bloopers, not delight in them.  It seems in the 80s DS had this reputation amongst uninformed journalists for being "campy." Lately, this notion has started to change a bit, and "horror/fantasy" magazines and websites in particular seem to be giving DS the place it deserves as a groundbreaking and legendary show in the genre DESPITE the mistakes.  People who make fun of the actors should try memorizing pages of lengthy monologues overnight and then recite those lines verbatim the next day in front of a camera. They can then repeat this 5 times a week.

   If you wish, do tell Jonathan there are a lot of fans who don't think DS is a camp-fest and who appreciate the work the actors and crew put into creating a serious dark fantasy show.

-Penny

While I have the anti-flood timers disabled on my own forum, and have had no trouble since all members must be activated by the admin before posting, I'm sure there are good reasons for having such a limitation here.

A clarification-- the Forums have never been flooded by a member.  Flooding is simply the addition of a large volume of data.

I'm sorry that our preventive method thwarts your enjoyment of the Forums, but I honestly don't anticipate that MB or I will have a change of heart about allowing the boards to become vulnerable to this type of attack again.  You're quite fortunate to not have had to deal with it on your own site, and I hope that will continue to be the case for you.  Whatever you decide, best of luck to you and Bugsie.

I think fans see DS as campy and enjoy it for the bloopers. This isn't exacty news nor is it a criticism.

If that is true, it is unfortunate and something of a slap in the face to the actors and people behind the scenes who worked hard to create a serious supernatural series.

I'm soooo with you. I was VERY shocked and a bit saddened by the level of interest in DS bloopers. Yeau, some are funny but I'm very tolerant of them and just grateful that the performers were still able to convey first class performances enough that I can still enjoy some superb gothic entertainment.

Yes, Janet I am. Can't wait to see you next week you crazy thing.

Wicked Wednesdays?? You talking 'bout the time Willie short-sheeted Missus Johnson's bed?

I will and forever be...wicked. I am looking forward to sharing a drink with you, Kerz. Tell the old man I love him.

Janet

I think most DS fans watch it for the good writing, acting and atmosphere and forgive the bloopers, not delight in them.

That's most certainly the way I feel.

It seems in the 80s DS had this reputation amongst uninformed journalists for being "campy." Lately, this notion has started to change a bit, and "horror/fantasy" magazines and websites in particular seem to be giving DS the place it deserves as a groundbreaking and legendary show in the genre DESPITE the mistakes.

It's been amazing how much respect DS has been receiving in print and on the Web in the past three years. Not amazing because DS doesn't deserve it - it truly does - but because, as you've said, the '80s and even into the '90s all we invariably read in nearly every article about DS was how "campy" it was. And what was more unfortunate than that was how the writers of said articles backed them up with passages from some of the PomPress books that, shall we be kind in saying, made it seem as if things actually happened on the show that never actually did (like, for one, the story about Terry Crawford supposedly [spoiler]bouncing off a matress and back into frame during Beth's fall from Widows' Hill[/spoiler]as if it actually went out over the air that way, which, as any DS fan who has seen the episode in question knows, it clearly did not  ). But then, it's certainly not the complete fault of the writers who trusted the info in the PomPress books. After all, so far as they were concerned, they most likely thought they could rely on the PomPress books because they were unaware of the, shall we say, certain inaccuracies and misconceptions the books all too sadly contain, often times in chapters written by the DS actors themselves. 

Back when the show was running, Karlen got accolades for his acting, and he was a perennial fan favorite. This is true. But that doesn't make me like the character any more. I cringe whenever I see Willie or Carl enter the scene

Oh, Professor! Say it aint so! Willie is da man after Barny. I am sad that Karlen isn't in the series more. He always makes things fun and yes he is over cafinated that is why we love him.

If you think of the actual character of Carl you can like him more. I like to try to think what makes the characters the way they are and what it is that you dont view on the screen. Carl is THE ONLY GOOD, INHERANTLY-SP?- GOOD, person on the show except for Liz. All the others are really bad.

Carl is sick and scared emotionally because he is in a family of very evil people. Judith is cold. Q is self centered and cares nothing for others not even Beth. Edward is cold and has no moral values though he pretends to. They ALL pretend to. They ain't no better than Trask in that regard.

At any rate, can you imagine living with those creeps? The psychological abuse? He's nutty and jumpy because he doesn't know who is really good or bad and he is afraid.

[spoiler]Poor Carl! Barny should suffer forever for killing him. He could have easily bit him or like he did with that child that saw him messing with Charity.[/spoiler]

And Willie...I just love Willie. The way he trembles you just gotta wonder what he REALLY knows. And I dont want to start any arguments nor am I implying that I am a person who likes or reads slash fiction but there is a real homoerotic thing in Barn-Will's relationship.

And Beth too is the only other ACTUALLY GOOD person on the show. I love Beth. I think she is pretty even though at first her appearance is unusual but we all cannot, THANKFULLY, be plastic dolls all basicly the same.

 

If that is true, it is unfortunate and something of a slap in the face to the actors and people behind the scenes who worked hard to create a serious supernatural series.

I must be reading things wrong if there is any doubt that most people (including fans) mention the DS mistakes, bloopers and clumsy acting before anything positive is mentioned.  If you look at synposis about the series you will see the word "campy" and mention of forgotten lines.  That's the mainstream media.

While it is not something that eats at me, even in this very forum it's evident many look for the bloopers and other screwups.  That's not a bad thing if that's what entertains the viewer but I find it difficult to understand the notion that's not what most DS fans enjoy and remember about the series.  It is.  Just reading this forum alone substantiates this.  I'm not saying  everyone holds the same view but I believe the one I am referring to is more prevalent than maybe some are willing to admit.  The first words out of people's mouths about Barnabas or Jonathan Frid is how much he screwed up his lines, not what he did with the character.  The first words out of the mouths of many fans I've met is how the sets falling apart and the many mistakes caught on camera.  There's nothing wrong with that if that is what entertains the viewer.  It's all there for entertainment.

But please don't tell me most fans do not spend more time discussing the mistakes, blown lines and clumsy acting than anything else. It's just not true from what I've seen here and elsewhere.  (I hope I am not coming off cranky because I'm not; just stating what I believe to be a fact.  There is nothing wrong with admitting this is the case.)

If you wish, do tell Jonathan there are a lot of fans who don't think DS is a camp-fest and who appreciate the work the actors and crew put into creating a serious dark fantasy show.

I tend to steer away from those discussions with him.  He came to believe what he does from reading DS websites, fan mail to his site, questions he got at the DS festivals, and some DS discussion groups his relatives told him about and print out stuff.   But, fortunately, even believing what he does, it doesn't gnaw at him or anything.    That's how he came to his conclusions - from what he has read and what he tends to be asked about the most.

But at any rate, entertainment is about the viewer and that viewer is free to take any program however he or she wishes.

Nancy