hoDS/NoDS DVD Release?

[Darren Gross]

All I'd ask is that from here on in, if anyone wants to jump in on any of these threads and talk about the possible restoration, please refrain from mentioning my name. I'm starting to feel really uncomfortable about having my name thrown about as much as it is, especially in posts that are critical of the studio, especially since it's something I have particularly shied away from.  I don't want to be perceived as a trouble-maker or source of irritation to the WB.  Because of the nature of forums and threads, they could very well assume that I'm posting much more critical comments under another name and throwing my name about in an effort to build my name up.

If Warners believes (however incorrectly) that I am antagonistic towards them, then it will erode the slight possibility of a restoration even further, and it will destroy any opportunities I might have of working with them or for them in the future, or any other studio that thinks I have a big mouth.  I have to be cognizant of that...  Though it's kind of like closing the barn door after the horse has left at this point...

[barnabasjr]

Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere, but this was an interesting read:
http://blogs.commercialappeal.com/the_bloodshot_eye/2012/12/dark-shad.html

[Mysterious Benefactor]

While the Watching Project is on its three week long holidays hiatus, the Games boards will almost exclusively focus on screen caps from and set ups for NoDS. And each board has been kicked off tonight with 20 new screen caps and/or set ups on the NoDS Complete this Phrase / Fill in the Blank(s) board and 8 new screen caps on its Caption This! board. Enjoy! 

[Mysterious Benefactor]

Of course I was aware that the opening and closing of NoDS on VHS is boxed - but foolishly it never occurred to me that that may have been something that MGM/UA did for the VHS and it wasn't actually that way when the film was originally released in theaters. Though it should have because obviously the film wasn't released in theaters with a 4X3 aspect ratio, so it couldn't have been boxed that way.

Check out the comparisons below between the VHS and the Blu-Ray (yes, I've figured out a way to get captures from the Blu-ray):
(I've put them in quote boxes simply to give a much better contrast against the background.)

This does have me wondering, though, if the boxing might have started with TV showings prior to the release of the VHS. Unfortunately, I taped over my TV copy of NoDS after I bought the VHS, so I have no way to compare the pre-VHS TV showings. Does anyone else still have their copies, or do you remember?

[KMR]

This does have me wondering, though, if the boxing might have started with TV showings prior to the release of the VHS.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that were the case, since the purpose of the windowboxing seems to be to ensure that title/credit data is within the "title safe" area so it doesn't get cut off by overscan on television sets.  On some sets, the black border may not be seen, because of the overscan.

[Mysterious Benefactor]

I was also thinking that perhaps that might have been a reason. Though perhaps it's odd that MGM/UA didn't do the same for hoDS:

And the interesting thing is that once the opening credits for NoDS become their widest, the credits are no longer boxed:

And though I could see MGM/UA doing the boxing for the closing credits of NoDS because those credits are much more widely spaced than the closing credits for hoDS are:

Even without boxing on the Blu-Ray, the black space to the left and right of the credits doesn't seem all that much wider on the VHS than it currently is on the Blu-Ray:

Who knows? 

[joe integlia]

the boxing may have been done to make the credits "tv safe" back when all tvs were 4x3. i dont know why they didnt do the same for h.o.d.s. and they didnt do it on the blu ray because now most tvs are 16x9

[Darren Gross]

Typically, it was usually done to compensate for the over-scanning of older tube televisions.  As Joe states, to keep the credits within the "title safe" area.  If you compare the end credits of HODS and NODS, you'll see that the text itself has a lot of room on either side in HODS, so there's very little chance of letters or names being cropped off due to overscanning.  Apparently they wanted to be doubly sure for NODS, though, to my eye, it still appears in the title safe area. 

[Mysterious Benefactor]

though, to my eye, it still appears in the title safe area.

Exactly. I can see where perhaps they wanted to make doubly sure the UPI ticker detailing the Jenkins' deaths didn't get cut off because that does seem just a bit wider than even the closing credits are. But if one shrinks the Blu-ray version of the closing credits to 320 pixels wide and does a comparison between it and the VHS version, do they really look all that different:

Certainly not with a difference as wide as the black boxing used in other parts of the film, so it actually begs the question as to whether or not they even boxed anything from the close of the film apart from the UPI ticker?

And then there's why even box part of the opening credits when no part of it during the boxing seems to have been likely not to have shown on a 4X3 TV, whereas DC's producer/director, which is the widest credit in the opening, wasn't even boxed?

But of course we weren't in the room when these decisions were made, so how are we to fathom that they did what they did?


But be that as it may, let's move on to something else - namely how I never really ever paid much notice to the sketch that's hanging on the wall near the door when Charles answers the door to Gabriel. And I have no idea how I actually could have paid little attention to it, particularly in the VHS version of the film where it seems to show up more prominently for a longer period of time:

Apparently one can easily presume that Angelique wasn't always as, uh, overly dressed as she was when she was posing for Charles' unfinished portrait.    And apparently this is yet further proof that no matter how often one watches something (and I've watched NoDS so many time that I lost count long ago) one can still pick up things on even more repeated viewings. 

(ADMIN: Edited to add better images, including a Laser Disc capture)

[Darren Gross]

If it makes you feel any better, in the entire filmed frame, the nude sketch glimpsed to the right of the above doesn't have Angelique's face on it.  It's more of a female body study.  There's no head on the sketch-- it ends at the neck...

 

[KMR]

And apparently this is yet further proof that no matter how often one watches something (and I've watched NoDS so many time that I lost count long ago) one can still pick up things on even more repeated viewings. 

And what *I* never seemed to notice so much before was that sexy shot of David's neck!  Time to pop that Blu-ray in the player again!   

[Mysterious Benefactor]

Oh, I would never want the woman in the sketch to be anyone other than Angelique. And let's face it, did Charles even have a model other than Angelique? It's hard to imagine given all that time that Laura lamented Angelique and Charles spent in the tower together. 

I can definitely see it as some fun, post-coital sketching as Angelique basks in the afterglow. And once the sketch was done, then it was on to round two, round three, or maybe even round ten. Who knows? I'm betting the birds were always getting an eyeful! 

[retzev]

There seems to be more picture information on all four sides of the 4x3. Was NoDS shot open-matte?

[Darren Gross]

There seems to be more picture information on all four sides of the 4x3. Was NoDS shot open-matte?

Yes- both HODS and NODS were shot open matte, but composed for 1.85. Most 1.85 films were shot that way.

I think the recent DVD transfer is a little too tight on the sides.  Not egregiously so, but unnecessarily.

[KMR]

There seems to be more picture information on all four sides of the 4x3. Was NoDS shot open-matte?

Yes, NODS was shot open matte, but the frames MB posted with the drawing are not identical frames. On the Blu-ray, I went to the same frame that MB posted from the VHS. The Blu-ray has very slightly more picture information on both the left and right sides as compared to the VHS. (And since this seems to confirm that the old video transfer was essentially "open frame", that explains why the DVD that I made from my laserdisc ended up looking pleasantly framed when I would watch it in zoom mode on my widescreen TV. It's essentially what the original intended to look like in the theaters.)