Dark Shadows: Why Such a Huge Gay Following?

[Midnite]

Hey Joey, sure, if the Mods agree and you don't mind taking the time to do so.

Since the author (and copyright owner, from what you've told us) has graciously provided his permission in writing, MB and I won't have a problem with it.

[Osnafla]

Didn't Star Trek and DS being broadcasting the same year (1966)?
I'm a fan of both....I did go through what was for me a biisexual "phase" (hmmmmmm). I'm gay identified now.
As the show wound up in the early 70's, I'm surprised Captain Kirk didn't drop by Collinwood....every other "alternate universe" was tried.
But seriously, as a gay man, I look back on the early years of DS with a lot of fondness.....I was 13 (lucky number...) when the show premiered....I thought the ads made it look scarey and mysterious.....and, yes, even then I was a big fan of the old-time movie queens (for a star of Joan Bennett's fame to appear ona soap was considered quite a big deal then...but remember, Joan Crawfiord, Bette Davis, Oliviia DeHaviland, Barbara Stanwyck, Geraldine Paige and other "older" actresses were starring in thrillers like What Ever Happened to Baby Jane, Straiit Jacket and Lady in a Cage, DS gave Ms. Bennett a great role and a chance to win over a new generation of fans in a role that did NOT require her to be confined to a wheel chair or wield an axe). Also, the show aired after school...good timing. DS also provided a welcome escape from the horrors of the Vietnam War and the intense political strife our country was going through....
I enjoyed the show a LOT, but I though it really took off when Barnabas arrives...he gave the whole thing more mystery, suspense and a deeper, more primal sense of menace (his blood lust)...he was a shunned tortured man, but he also had POWER, and that is very attractive as well to a generation of gays that just began to feel it's political influence.
The show also engaged our imaginations in a way that conventional soaps never could...not only did we have a vampire who aroused our sympathies (Dracula never did THAT), but most of America never heard of the I Ching before this show and the idea that reaility iis a concept more flexible than Westerners  usually consider. Also, maybe witchcraft is not such a bad thing after all if you can look like Lara Parker and possess her power.

--Osnafla

[markyboo]

I always wanted to find a "Collinwood" of my own when I was a teen. To me it represented a place where, no matter who or what you were, you were accepted. In the early '70's, there was NOTHING on television that mentioned homosexuality (and if it happened to be mentioned, it was usually negative), so I think some gay teens were attracted to a series like DS for the same reasons I was. It was easy to identify with Barnabas and his struggles just as we gays in that era dealt with our struggles. Also, we gays have always appreciated - worshipped! - strong, independent women and DS was full of them: Julia, Elizabeth, Angelique, etc. al.  I think gays being attracted to DS is like how many of my brethern are attracted to musicals - DS and musicals are these magical, bigger-than-life places where people do fantastic things! Also, DS had such gorgeous costumes and such handsome sets and we gays love the finest in clothing and decor. FInally, so many of the DS characters say such witty, wicked things - and gays always love snappy dialogue!

Oh, many, many years ago, I sent that SECRET ROOM dude a letter with a SASE to receive info on his publication. Never heard back from him - I am astonished to find out he actually published an issue!

[MagnusTrask]

I've wondered about this thread's question, but I sort of thought the gay men would just be answering the question, not asking it...!

A large contingent of TV show fandoms are those who go for action and flashy effects.  It's true for some shows more than others.   With Trek, there's a massive crowd that doesn't seem to appreciate ST as drama in the vein of the science-fiction literary genre, and judges it by how frequent and elaborate the explosions, ray-guns, and spaceships are.   

I can do without that part of fandoms.    I don't wish them any harm, but I want to feel "at home" in a fandom, and they're alien to me.    I'm someone who is utterly baffled that anyone would even want the ST episodes "remastered" with flashier images of ships and planets, but that's another story.....

Maybe gays go more for atmosphere than action?    If so, good, me too.    1897 gets a bit action-y, but overall, there isn't much in DS for the people who want fistfights and gunplay.

I'm not sure why I need to say it here and now, but I feel (and always have felt) just about as alienated from society as gay men have, if not more.    I mean, in childhood, up to the present.   I've had to fight all my life to believe that there really isn't anything deeply wrong with me, after all.    I'm not gay; it was about more general, less easily identifiable traits or viewpoints....

It seems to me that Barnabas's near-certainty that he WAS guilty of terrible things, and not just a misunderstood outsider, probably parallels guilt ingrained very deeply into gays from their first moments, especially back then.     He has a big black question mark hovering over him all the time.     Sure, he's reformed, and didn't have a choice in being a vampire, but part of any human being probably doesn't care about fairness when assigning guilt.    After all, he's cursed by God... (indirectly...)-- cursed without a judgment or a trial.   Simple cursing by a witch seperates you from God forever, and God apparently doesn't care if you did anything to deserve it.   The vampire's nature is inherently evil, and Barnabas is stuck with it, as evidenced by the fact that crosses hurt him.  The universe isn't fair, to put it mildly.

Same with gays, at least decades ago.   You may know you're hard-wired for gayness, it's your nature, and people around you judging you may not even disagree about that part... but even if it's not a "choice", it's still "wrong" and maybe even "evil", etc..     Yes, you may be just a damn (insert epithet here), it's not anything you did, it's something you just are..., and that thing you are is supposedly loathesome.   

It's a weird, very destructive and unfair form of blame that becomes internalized.   I'm losing focus as I always do, and I'm not sure if the point got made.    I hope so.   

[Gothick]

Another top "gay" moment in DS is the scene in Parallel Time 1970 where Roger and "Alexis" are having a gossip and Roger smirks that mentioning Maggie Collins in the same breath as Angelique is like comparing a sable to a mouse.

Edmonds' delivery, and Parker's admiring smirk of response, make this one of the cattiest scenes in the entire show.  I've always thought that PT Roger was meant to be a twisted gay character in the vein of the late, great Clifton Webb in the classic 1940s film noir Laura.  Roger didn't just admire Angelique--he wanted to BE her, on at least one level.  Edmonds played PT Roger with an air of ruined grandeur in the scenes where he was alone soliloquizing to Angelique's portrait that definitely had a Forties feel to it.

I realize that today's viewers may vehemently deny that there's anything remotely "gay" about PT Roger--I'm just offering my opinion here.

G.

[MagnusTrask]

I don't think those vehement denials are coming.

[Sandor]

local handymen/hunks like joe haskell and chris jennings add a certain beefy charm.

That was my first thought. Though the many other insights posted here are well said and appreciated.  But ahhh, that beefy Jennings charm....

[Gerard]

Like David, I, too, watched DS because it was scary (well, it was back then to a kid - there were times when I watched it with my hands over my eyes).  I never considered my fondness for it, back then, as having anything to do with my orientation; I didn't even know what that was all about.  I just liked horror - scary monsters, ghosts, things from another world eating New Jersey, etc.  I couldn't get enough of shows like The Twilight Zone, The Outer Limits, Thriller, Lost in Space, Star Trek, et. al.  I have friends who are also gay, including my best friend, who absolutely loathed DS (and anything scary).  Nothing in it piqued their gayness.

Gerard

[Nelson Collins]

That was my first thought. Though the many other insights posted here are well said and appreciated.  But ahhh, that beefy Jennings charm....

There just isn't any other word for it, but Vampire Tom was .... hot ....

[David]

Mr. Trask: all "outsiders" can find a home in the gay community, regardless of your personal orientation.

Now here's an interesting question:
do strong women like Julia/Angelique appeal to lesbians?

David

[Nancy]

I'm not a lesbian but the characters appeal to me.  I'm not crazy about the connotation that if you are a lesbian you are a strong woman or visa versa.  Lesbians don't come in a mold, neither do straight women.

Nancy

Now here's an interesting question:
do strong women like Julia/Angelique appeal to lesbians?

[Gothick]

I was thinking about this thread again this morning and something I personally feel was a touch of artistic genius in Jonathan Frid's performance:  no matter how many flubs he made with his lines, in his non-verbal moments he would turn those sad, soulful eyes towards the camera with this look of such tragic mournfulness, I think every viewer in the audience felt that she or he could identify with the secret sorrows of Barnabas Collins.

I'm phrasing this very awkwardly, but I do think that this was what made Frid's work in the role so brilliantly memorable.  When he was on with the lines, no question about it, the Voice was a truly magnifcent instrument.  One of the best known scenes is the original 1967 recounting of Josette's death, but there were many other moments throughout his four years in the role.

I just post this because although I do think that Barnabas had a special appeal for gay children and older gay men as well, I can see how the qualities of Frid's performance gave the character an appeal that touched many people across generations, sexualities, etc.

I'll also echo Gerard's thought that I know many gay men who fail to see the fun or fabulosity of Dark Shadows.

G.

[David]

I was thinking about this thread again this morning and something I personally feel was a touch of artistic genius in Jonathan Frid's performance:  no matter how many flubs he made with his lines, in his non-verbal moments he would turn those sad, soulful eyes towards the camera with this look of such tragic mournfulness, I think every viewer in the audience felt that she or he could identify with the secret sorrows of Barnabas Collins.

I'm phrasing this very awkwardly, but I do think that this was what made Frid's work in the role so brilliantly memorable.  When he was on with the lines, no question about it, the Voice was a truly magnifcent instrument.  One of the best known scenes is the original 1967 recounting of Josette's death, but there were many other moments throughout his four years in the role.

I just post this because although I do think that Barnabas had a special appeal for gay children and older gay men as well, I can see how the qualities of Frid's performance gave the character an appeal that touched many people across generations, sexualities, etc.

In particular during 1795, the sadness in Barnabas' eyes was heartbreaking, the brilliance of Frid hypnotic!
Anyone who felt like they didn't quite "fit in" could relate to the tragic plight of Barnabas Collins.

David

[adamsgirl]

I agree whole-heartedly about Frid's overall performance. His voice is magnetic, hypnotic, powerful -- all sorts of adjectives come to mind. As for his expressions, let's just say, the man is a master!

About the lesbian question. Like Nancy, I am not a lesbian. I do, however, have several friends who are. While it's so difficult, maybe even foolish, to generalize, my friends do admire powerful women. In fact, many of them are powerful women. As a straight woman, I, too, find that much more attractive than some simpering, whiny, "helpless" female.

[MagnusTrask]

Me too...   

And thanks, David, a hopeful note in a generally dismal situation....