Another Frid Q&A/ Talks about DS 1982

[Nancy]

This was scanned and sent to me. I believe it came from Kathy Resch's The World of Dark Shadows fanzine, but I'm not sure. Anyway, this is the transcription and introduction as I received it.



Jonathan Frid Question and Answer Session
July 3, 1982
ShadowCon VI, Los Angeles, California


His first ever appearance at a Dark Shadows convention was the occasion of ShadowCon VI held in California.  Several people who attended this event all described the packed room as being "electric" waiting for the first personal appearance in over ten years by Jonathan Frid to a DS crowd.  He showed up smiling and wearing a yellow tweed sports jacket and the crowd just erupted with applause and cheers welcoming him back into the fold after his long absence.

Jonathan Frid: I promise that for tomorrow's events I will dress more somberly (Laughter). I just had to go "California" for a few hours. (Laughter)    I want to thank you all, especially the committee, for bringing me out here.  I have been looking forward to this. I'm very flattered and honored.  I would have done this sooner but I've been a recluse for years but, now, I'm out of my shell, or my coffin, or whatever. (Laughter).  I think my talk will go very quickly into some clips that we have here plus some recent TV interviews in New York.  

Anyway, I have come out into the open again recently in New York because the show is playing there.  That is why I have become so interested in resurrecting some kind of career for myself, and so allow myself this exposure.  You see, I'm not having to learn lines every day so I'm enjoying this more than when I did originally.  I was to busy learning the scripts every day to really know what was happening.  Anyway, about two or three weeks ago in New York one of the Disco places called Magique, with cooperation from NBC, put on a party for the New York Blood Bank but that was a charity anyway.  We put some clips together from various old episodes that I had gotten from the old days.  You see, some of the smaller communities in the country played DS in delayed phases so they had black and white films.  We got somebody from ABC to get them, about 10 in all, to make clips and then we spent a whole afternoon putting them together at ABC.  Three or four of us went through these things and put them together for a run at the Magique disco during rehearsal.  At the rehearsal it worked beautifully. But that night someone poured a drink over the video machine, so we never had a chance to preview the clips. So, tonight, will be the first time these clips have been shown. I mean, for an audience.  The clips are very rough because there is no editing so it will arbitrarily cut from one thing to another.  One of the people from NBC tried to do something fancy in the beginning because you will see the DS waves and all that.  A little gimmick.  But what really matters are all of the scenes that I don't know where they came from.  The clips represent a long period of time -- about two years I think.  These various bits and pieces is like going through a whole lifetime.  Of course, working on Dark Shadows for four years was like a lifetime.  There were so many stories that happened that no that I've been away from the set for years and then to see it again, I don't recognize it.  It was like going way back to your younger days. Of course, that is what the theater is, a whole lifetime shortened.

Anyway, it was a fascinating afternoon putting these things together because it recalled so many stories, so many actors that were on the show.  There was a marvelous character that I had forgotten all about.  How many of you remember the character "Pansy"?

Audience: (claps)

JONATHAN FRID: Delightful! And I had forgotten that story completely. It's like forgetting a part of your life.  And, of course, there was John Karlen when he was playing . . what?

AUDIENCE: Carl!

JONATHAN FRID: That's right!  But that's me, forgetful.  I had totally forgotten that he was in that segment and it was a beautiful production job.  There was some nice, nice work in that latter part of the series and in such a little theater.

Well, anyway, enough of my ramblings.  Let's show this thing.  I think the clips are followed by an interview that I did that I have yet to see.  A NBC news broadcast "Live At Five" that did an interview with me that aired last week.  Actually, the interview was done a month ago in my apartment in New York.  This is another interview by Entertainment Tonight that lasted 20 minutes but they said it was to run 20 seconds. It's not a bad little interview.  If you have any questions about what you've seen or what I've said, or want to talk about it afterwards, I'll be delighted.  I'll stay til four in the morning if you want me to. (Audience laughs and applauds)

There are lots of things going on here and I would kind of like to see them myself.  Now, let's see what this tape is all about.

AFTER THE CLIPS ARE OVER

JF:   This is the first time that I have seen that interview!!  And I am beginning to look like the old man you had seen earlier (the old Barnabas).  I can see the vicissitude of life or whatever.  While watching these old clips I thought that was a prettier old man in the series than in the movie. I had a head of nice white hair.  And looking at that sort of reminded me of the old style we did, almost like a Fritz Lang movie.  Almost a silent film style. Wherever it came from I always thought that my particular style came from the fact that I was never quite on top of any performance.  I knew what I was going for but I never was very comfortable about it.  Very seldom was I comfortable with it I should say.

A very good friend, that could say it to me, and it is very true, that my style was almost like I was in a tank of water.  You know, everything is in slow motion. (Laughter)

That reminds me of a very funny story about DS that took place here in Los Angeles about 10 years ago, I guess.  Over at Paramount, we used to go over to the restaurant by the gates where everyone went for lunch.  I was never so impressed with one place in my life. I mean, the Names ..  I think John Wayne was there and Paul Newman was sitting having lunch with someone.  There were superstars all over the place.  I was agog and had been all week. I mean, I felt like a tourist. So anyway, the restaurant was jammed and we worked our way to the bar to get a drink while we waited for a table.  When I got to the bar, the bartender just about fainted.  All these superstars . He had just served Paul Newman and when he served me he almost drops dead! (Laughter and applause) We had a big giggle over that.  The reason he was so excited was that he was such a DS fan that every afternoon -- I guess they cleaned up about 4 oclock -- and he and a writer over at Paramount would have an early afternoon cocktail, lunch drink or whatever, and turn the show on.  Then they would turn off the sound and make up their own dialogue.  I can almost sense when you get in a group with this DS thing you can almost hear someone come up with a line in advance.  That feeling reminded me of that story.  So every day the bartender and writer would make a game out of watching the show religiously every afternoon and making up their own script.  I said he should have written the line down, I would have loved to have seen what he had done.

Anyone have any questions?

QUESTION: In your work as a Shakespearian actor, is there any particular character that you enjoyed playing?

JF: Yes.  My favorite all-time role in anything is Richard III.  There is no character more villainous than Richard.  I was saying in an interview upstairs that the part that really affected Barnabas as much as part that I've played would be Macbeth.  Richard and Macbeth I have always compared.  Richard, of course, is straight out-and-out villain and in no way can you b ringing any kind of sympathy to his character except if you play him in an amusing sort of way. His brilliance and his wit is the part of him that can be so attractive . .can almost make him comic.  I always thought Olivier almost went too far with that approach.  He is still a hard character and really should be horrifying.  Richard has one scene in the last act, just before the last battle where he is killed, where he has this dreadful nightmare.  Richard delivers this convoluted speech . .that speech is one of my very favorites.  It is very difficult to do, especially when you have been going for four acts and you have a call for these battle scenes.  This is a very strange, weird, weird scene of a person who can't get out of a nightmare.  Have you ever had that experience?  I have had, often in my life.  In that speech he sees all the ghosts of the people he has murdered.  And they all come across in this agonizing nightmare.  It was only in that one speech in the whole play that there is any deep understanding of Richard, or going inside of his nature. Whereas in Macbeth, he is doing the agonizing all through the play.  If it were for his wife, he would never get anything done because he is so busy agonizing.  Like Hamlet, he agonizes, has doubts and has horrible thoughts about what he is doing throughout the play sothe audience can develop a sympathy or empathy for Macbeth.

The other day I was remembering when I first got the role of Barnabas. I was invited to come up to the studio to see the producer .  But Curtis was away in Europe at the time so the only thing they could do was have me see Robert Sullivan who was actually doing the casting. I wondered at the time why he wanted me up there for the weekend before my first show.  Were they going to sack me already? Did they change their minds?  That's my complex, the way I would think.  I remember going all the way up and thinking why don't they just tell me over the phone? So I got up there and that was not the case at all.  Art Wallace, who structured the play, and the writers, Bob Costello among them, about six were at this conference table and they explained they wanted to meet me to discuss how the role of Barnabas was to be developed.  Well, I never had this happen to me in my life.  Before I was just told to go home and learn my lines and get on with it.  This was a very grand type of experience for me.

We had three scripts to go by at this point, my introduction and the two days following.  That's all I had to go on, however, we discussed the role and I came with this business of Macbeth.  From what I could see how the character might develop, wejust didn't want to make him a villain, we wanted to allow more scope.  Well, I thought of Macbeth when I played this role and I think it shaped him in my head more than any role I had previously played.

Question: Mr. Frid, when you did the movie "Seizure", it wasn't distributed widely in the United States.  Is there something behind that?

JF: Are you implying that it was widely distributed someplace else?  Well, anyway, I guess it just didn't make it.  It was interesting. By the way, do you know who wrote that?  He won the academy award for writing 3 or 4 years ago for the movie "Midnight Express".  Oliver Stone, that was his picture.  Well, anyway, "Seizure" was a very low budget film we did up in Quebec.  It was the craziest thing.  Well, it was an underground movie is what it was.  Crazy. A very bad experience.  I thought that they didn't have enough to put together to make a picture.  We did it in about four weeks and considering the time they had, it was not too bad. The last few days up there were awful.   It had a good idea and it had a marvelous kind of story.

[Nancy]

Question: Was it nightmarish to you as far as playing the part?

JF: Not particularly to play it although I didn't have much difficulty.  I thought some of the lines were poor and some of the scenes were poor.  It was overwritten.  Very much DS, like any soap is.  Dialogue, dialogue, dialogue.  That's all I need, more dialogue to memorize, or not memorize. (Laughter)  It really should have more action.  For example, the long scene when we talk about evil with the old man, it should have been done another way.  It had a long discourse on the theory of evil and I thought it should have been dramatized.  Anyway, that was part of the problem. But there were some interesting themes in the picture.  I don't know why it didn't do well.  It wasn't a good movie but, then again, there were a lot of lousy movies released at the same time.

[NOTE: It was later revealed in a biography on Oliver Stone that the problem behind the lack of distribution for the film was that the financial backers held back the release of "Seizure" because of some outstanding problems with the production company/Oliver Stone.]

Question: Do you have a favorite line from Richard III? And can we hear it?

JF: And now is the winter of our discontent . .. I had to battle the director over that line. And now is the winter of our discontent made glorious this summer by the son of York . .. [Audience applauds] Yeah, I read it. [Laughter] Richard suggests that he is proud of Yorks because now York takes Lancaster and defeats the York family.  He announces that he is going to do just that and says this is the winter of our discontent made glorious this summer by the son of York, meaning his brother.  So do we say the words with great pride and joy, or does he mean that he is going to say this sarcastically?  The only disagreement I had with the director was over that first line.


Question: You mentioned a hobby in the Live at Five interview.  What is the hobby?

JF: Espanol.  But none test me on it because I get very nervous.  That all started when I visited South America.  Does anyone know how popular this show as in South America?  I went down to Paraguay, of all places, and had a fabulous time.  I was honored by the President and the President's wife, who was completely addicted to the thing.  The used to change their national soccer game just to watch the show. They were totally absorbed.  Of course, this thing was run prime-time down in Paraguay.  I was so intrigued when I saw the show in spanish that I did a tour of South America. By the way, I totally threw everyone down there because they didn't recognize my voice.  I had two interpreters down there with me and when they interpreted for me the audience would be baffled by the voice.  The voice.  The whole shows sounds marvelous in Spanish.  BARNnnaBUS!!!! And we say sissy-like Barnabassssss (mocking sissy speech).  The Spanish, they knew how to do it . .the whole show was that way, it had much more gusto. And it went with our gestures better.  Our roles were always overreacting anyway and Spanish somehow has that bravero that the English doesn't seem to give us. It was very very effective in Spanish.

Question: I read an article somewhere that you have a directing degree.  Have you directed a play?

JF: No.  I did it all in Yale and that was it.  I would like to direct but directing is a very difficult profession to get into it.  But, someday, I would like to do it.  By the way, this is probably the appropriate time to tell you all what I am working on right now . .which I have wanted to do a million times before is present lectures all over the country.  I have been invited by a lecture group in New York to present these lectures.  Of course, they thought it would be a great opportunity.  We are negotiating the contracts now. I am going to do a lecture tour in the fall which will be a springboard for the DS thing naturally (the syndication of the series).  This is all in the development stages right now. I am working with a young writer in New York to get together ideas.    It will be partly lecture like what I've done today but more formalized.  I will discuss the gothic themes using gothic literature and then I will move on from there into a performing level.  So it will be more like a one-man show.  I may get into talking about the soap opera, especially the DS phenomenon.  We are open to ideas because we will be working most of the summer researching and looking for material. I don't know whether we will get into Shakespeare or whether that would be too obvious, but we will stay in the nineteenth century where gothic literature really developed.  But, anyway, that is my current activity.  And now I would like to throw it open to you, if any of you are interested or have any suggestions . .because we are groping and looking.  I suggest that you can forward your mail to me through ShadowCon. If anyone would like to correspond with me about this project or offer encouragement . . .

Question: Who are you closest to on Dark Shadows and do you still keep in touch with most of the cast?

JF: I suppose, no . . . not really.   I don't keep in touch.  The only person I see on a regular basis
is Louis Edmonds .  And then, now, not for some months.  The one person I do look forward to seeing tomorrow is John Karlen, whom I love dearly.  A sweetheart of a guy and he helped me, God knows, so often in that show.  He really is a wonderful guy, a marvelous actor. And I understand that he has a new series.  

Audience: "Cagney and Lacey!"

JF: Yes, well, there it is.  You seem to know everything.  Well, anyway, he was a very dear friend, dear friend. It's a great thing about the theater, an interesting aspect of showbiz life, especially when I used to be in repretory or doing one show here or one show there, you develop friends very quickly.  You become very intimate because you work together closely. And I suppose, you're in a strange town and you are together with no other social outlet but your own group.  You can see how we could become a very tightly knit group.

Question: If you had an option to do either stage or TV, I'm sure you love would be stage.  Is that right?

JF: Well, yes.

Question: Would you accept a TV role?

JF: Why not?

Question: Have you ever done comedy?

JF: Yes, the last thing I did, in fact, four years ago which was kind of nice at Penn State.  It was an anniversary where they brought back all the people who had played leads there.  I was Richard III there and then at this I played Tony Cavendish in "The Royal Family" which was Barrymore's role on Broadway.  I played it in college when I was too young for it, then here I was too old to play it! I played it like Groucho Marx or one of the Marx Brothers.  I had a little bit of trouble with the director in that one too.  He wanted me to play it with much more Barrymore Bravuro.  And, I knew I could do that, that was easy.  But what I wanted to do was to pace it.  And he kept saying "no, no, take your time, take your time.  I had that in mind in the end, but I wanted to get the main value going first.  To keep it moving.  That guy just sizzled in that house.  He was off to Europe and back and off to California and back. And in the house he was just a whirlwind of dust and people flying all over the place.  This is the way this thing had to be played.  So I was falling all over myself during the rehearsals to get it going. I wanted to get more than anything else that aspect going: the grandeur of family would come later.  But the director became very nervous, thinking that I would never come to that point.  It was an interesting play to do. I love doing comedy.  And I think I am very good at it. It depends on the role.

(see next part)

[Nancy]

Question: The role you played in "Devil's Daughter" of the mute, how do you compare that role to your roles on "Dark Shadows"?  Was it more difficult or less so?

JF: That was a disappointing role for me. They intended, and they told me, that they were going to do more with that role. Somehow it just didn't get done.  I accepted the job for the money at the time.  I really didn't enjoy that particular role.

Audience: "You were great!"

JF: Well, thank you very much.

Question: Was "Seizure" shot in Ontario or Quebec?

JF: No, it was shot in Quebec.  100 miles north of Montreal.

Audience: Would you do more horror films today?

JF: Well, I would love to do Richard III, sure.  What better horror show could you have?  But I want to do human roles.  When I think of horror I think of biting all the time, or being a werewolf all of the time.  I want something more mental or philosophic.  I really don't know what I'm trying to say . . . . (laughter).

Question: Did you have a favorite storyline on DS yourself?

JF: I was so concerned learning the lines that I could not be concerned with the story.  That is why I am enjoying the series now. I am more aware now of whether the plot tightens.  I can understand now why the ratings work like the stock market . .going up and down all the time from week to week.   I have an objectivity, a perspective on the thing now.  But half the time I was so absorbed in just getting a scene together I really didn't pay that much attention to the plot. It wasn't when a plot was good that I was happy, it was when a script as well written.  And that would happen every 2 or 3 weeks.

Well, maybe one more question.

Question: In the past few years there has been a trend in revival films such "Gilligan's Island" when they rescued the cast.  If there was a 2-hour "Dark Shadows" film would you be interested in being the character of Barnabas?

JF: Yeah.  It depends on how the script is.  You know I wasn't too happy with that movie script.  I thought it was just an easy cop-out, a rehash of what we had already done. It didn't have the charm of the TV series.  I would be careful on how I did Barnabas again.  It would have to be a good script.

End of Q&A.
 

My note:  Frid was in the planning stages of going to San Diego to teach drama, and also to appear at the Globe Theater again in its famed Shakespeare Theater. He had planned on being there in the summer of 1967.

Frid did two plays during the run of DS, which were well received critically, and very well attended such was his popularity at the time.

[Birdie]

Thank you so very much.

Birdie

[Raineypark]

Ah, Nancy, I think you put that whole thing up just for me and Carol, because he says such nice things about John Karlen.....LOL
Thanks again,
Raineypark

[VAM]

Thanks once again!

[kuanyin]

I certainly didn't know that Frid had worked with Oliver Stone! Personally, I don't think Stone has improved that much over the years from what Frid has to say about him making poor choices in moviemaking. But it is interesting. I wonder if "Seizure is available for viewing?

[Nancy]

I certainly didn't know that Frid had worked with Oliver Stone! Personally, I don't think Stone has improved that much over the years from what Frid has to say about him making poor choices in moviemaking. But it is interesting. I wonder if "Seizure is available for viewing?

"Queen of Evil" or "Seizure"was Stone's directorial debut.  The film was never distributed in the usual way because Stone's investors didn't see where they were getting their money back from the director.  They held the film hostage, so it died. Unfortunately, this was a film that could have been something decent as a thriller with some editing.  

You can get the film on ebay. Do a search for "Jonathan Frid" (include his name in the description" or "Oliver Stone").  You can just search for SEIZURE.

Nancy

[Josette]

These are fantastic, thanks again!

[Nancy]

Ah, Nancy, I think you put that whole thing up just for me and Carol, because he says such nice things about John Karlen.....LOL
Thanks again,
Raineypark

Rats, I was found out!

As you can see from John Karlen's Q&A, the feeling was mutual.  

Nancy