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Messages - ZackGolem

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Current Talk '24 I / Re: Depp/Burton DARK SHADOWS Is In Release!!
« on: June 02, 2012, 06:48:42 PM »
I thought I heard the movie surpassed 170 mil worldwide days ago? This is a flop? I have no evidence but I personally don't believe the budget was as big as has been reported. I think it's probably been in the black for awhile. To the outside world that doesn't care about the source material this would be a pretty typical Burton movie, whimsical, weird, visually cartoonish. I don't see where people would be especially confused.

I saw it three times over three weeks in mostly full houses with very engaged audiences. Various Facebook pages have people posting constantly about how much they love it. Bad word of mouth? Burton has his haters which eviscerate pretty much everything he does. The love it or hate it aspect of the movie might actually work in it's favor. In any case I never thought a sequel for this particular enterprise was a given. Burton doesn't do many sequels ( I can only think of Batman) and nether does Depp. Pirates, sure, but that's a Disney cash cow. Dark Shadows is more like a small art film with a big budget. I think the movie will definitely find it's legs on people's TVs for years to come (where it was big in the first place!).

With Dark Shadows remakes currently arriving 20 years apart (Not counting 2004's abortion. I saw the snippet on Alec Newman's web site. Was that The Barnabas Diaries?) I may not be around for the next one but I'm hoping for a series mash-up of classic Marilyn Ross and Gold Key comics plots which put a new spin on Barnabas, his master-of -disguises cousin Quentin, and Hare, Barnabas's faithful manservant. Ok, not really.

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Current Talk '24 I / Re: Depp/Burton DARK SHADOWS Is In Release!!
« on: May 20, 2012, 12:22:23 AM »
I'd be surprised if this movie actually took 150 mil to make. I don't see it on screen. Sure, the sets look great but what major studio film doesn't have good looking sets? The CGI sequences are brief and not especially elaborate or ground breaking. Much of the film is people sitting or standing around talking, soap opera style. Seems more likely the budget was closer to the intially reported 50 mil in which case they'd be closer to breaking even and going into the black, and paving the way for sequels. Yay! It also doesn't seem likely the studio would take such a major gamble on an unproven commodity as a Burton/Depp helmed DS reboot. You'd think they would stick with a fairly modest budget first time around. But I actually have no idea. In any case, having just seen The Avengers, it's obvious (and should have been so to the highly paid WB studio muckity-mucks) that DS should have never been pitted against such a large scale spectacle. Maybe they will release the DVD around Halloween when people are more into the spooko (as DC used to say).

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Current Talk '24 I / Re: Depp/Burton DARK SHADOWS Is In Release!!
« on: May 12, 2012, 07:07:39 AM »
I'd love to see a sequel. The end of this film went so far off the reservation I can't even imagine what a sequel would be like. They would have one insane blasphemous mess to get out of for sure! This is a very interesting and imaginative version of DS, loaded with homages to the source material. If I had a dvd of the movie, I'd be watching it again right now. It can't be everything to everybody and who cares if the script wobbles a bit?  It has the Burton whimsical vibe, which was always going to be the defining tone. It does make one wonder what another creative team might have done. The new film is short on actual horror and scares. By contrast the original two films actually are legitimately creepy and horrifying. We can only imagine how another director might have used those films as inspiration to amp of the fear factor. There's a million ways you can reinterpret a classic. To each his own!

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I think I actually tried to write Gold Key a letter when I was 8 or 9, pleading with them to make the series better. I used to look at the books about once every 4 or 5 years and mainly got disgusted with the bad ones. When the reprints starting coming out I was surprised at how many of them really hold up as little gems of great comic book storytelling. I just read that Hermes is also planning a 'Best Of' edition with 12 books included. I think their 12 best will differ from mine because my list would be comprised mainly of issues in the first 3 or 4 years and theirs will span the entire series. (You gotta encourage folks to buy 'em all!)

I also tried to read a couple of the Marilyn Ross  books a few years ago and didn't think they were too bad. I liked them more as a kid but the Gothic romance novel is not really my area. But I do regard these things as more than kitsch memorabilia, Dark Shadows Ice Cream or bubblegum stickers.  I look at Dark Shadows and specifically Barnabas as a literary figure along the lines of Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, or Dracula. Their stories have been told in lots of different formats and each one can have validity. I think the movie is going to be a very deviant version. I wish I knew Tim Burton so I could campaign to draw the graphic novelization!

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A side note about romance in the DS comics, quite a few of them feature romantic elements. There's one book in the not yet released Hermes volume three that I'm looking forward to seeing digitally remastered. It concerns Barnabas trapped in an other worldly dimension where he falls in love with a dead ringer for Josette/ Victoria.

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MB- The writing in those books wasn't as shabby as one might assume. Most of the writers were anonymous but a couple of them were very big names, and wrote comics for other publishers that are now considered classics. People have pointed out that that some of the stories in the DS books are like blueprints for what could have been very interesting tv plots or DS movies. The early stories were very sincere and straightlaced but later in the series an element of parody creeped in and some of it reads almost like SNL skits. There was one book where Barnabas was being pursued by enemies and he riggged his coffin to spew deadly gas in case anyone opened it. Big larfs!

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Michael--I'd be hard pressed to really disagree with anything you say. I'd just add it's a perception thing. You could say the same about the tv series, and people do, it's silly and juvenile, the acting is bad, the writing is worse, ect, ect. Well sure, sometimes, but if you stop there you miss a lot.

I have little interest in the romantic aspects of DS. I don't care if I ever hear Josette's name again.  My favorite plots would probably be 1897 and the first half of Leviathans.  Different strokes!

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G-

Comic fans in general are a pretty dedicated bunch. Like I was saying a lot of people who likes the comics aren't really into the tv series. Gold Key, the company who did DS, actually has it's own fandom. There's been various reprint volumes of their stuff coming out for years that have a fairly dedicated following.
 
What's wrong with Jeff Thompson's work? His articles in the Hermes volumes aren't bad.

I don't know for a fact that was the reason Gold Key axed the Willie character after 5 panels. Just a guess. Gold Key had a sterling reputation as a kid friendly publisher. They didn't have to display the comics code authority seal like the rest of the industry. It's kind of odd they took on DS--it was a fairly subversive book. Like the early episodes of the tv show,
Barnabas in the first couple of Gold Key books was a rather ruthless character, willing to murder innocent people to protect his secret. Julia too, was willing to ingage in morally questional behavior. Strange stuff to be presenting to kid comic book readers!

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Calendar Events / Announcements '14 I / !!
« on: November 11, 2011, 07:49:25 AM »
interesting thoughts about carolyn and maggie. some other strange "ingenue" always seems to show up for each self-contained story to fill the gap.

That Cheshire Collins story was actually a very good one. I never thought of the Roger Davis connection. Carolyn had a clone in Constance Collins. She was a dead ringer for Carolyn but Liz's cousin instead of daughter. She showed up at a dinner party Liz was throwing ( But wait!!Liz never threw dinner parties on tv! Wrong!). Trouble is, The Gold Key Collins had hardly any friends (or family) so usually nobody showed up at these parties (who didn't already live in the house) but Julia and Stokes. Barnabas tried to kill Connie, then save her when she acccidently got thrown into hell. Don't tell me that's not a great comic! Some beautiful drawings of Hell in that book.

They brought back Connie in probably the worst drawn book of the series. I don't know what the problem was, but poor old Certa did not bring his A-game!

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Oh yeah Gothick, how could I forget. There's some fairly deep essaying on Gold Key DS in the actual Hermes volumes by somebody named Dr. Jeff Thompson. I think I'd read some of it on the net before it was published in the books. That's probably where some of the other articles I read are now. They pulled 'em off the net so people will have to buy them in the future volumes!

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i can't determine who's actually living at collinwood in these stories. liz, roger, quentin and julia? and barnabas at the old house? or is there not an old house?
...
i actually prefer the cover paintings to the art inside.

The cover paintings were by someone named George Wilson who also painted tons of covers for other Gold Key books, Twilight Zone, Boris Karloff Tales of Mystery and others. Yes, he was very good.

Liz, Roger, Quentin and Barnabas lived at Collinwood. There was no Old House. In issue one, Willie Loomis is seen heading toward a house that COULD be the Old House. It's a house mostly obscured by a word balloon and it's a very different depiction from any of the other shots of Collinwood. He knocks on a door which is answered by Barnabas. After briefly helping Barnabas with problem he's never seen again. Perhaps the producers thought the relationship was too complicated for a kids' comic and decided to close that can of worms. Julia lived in a small wood frame house in Collinsport. Barnabas's coffin room was in a cellar at Collinwood which was often shown with an open barred window. You would think someone  outside could be passing by and look down and  see the coffin. In one bizarre scene, Quentin must fly off in a plane on some mission and Barnabas is seen looking out his cellar window and can actually see the jet plane flying through the sky.

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http://comicattack.net/2011/01/ffgtrjan212011/

Here's one for you, Gothik. I saw a few more around the times the Hermes books came out but I don't know if they're still up. There's some reviews on Amazon. There used to be some very in-depth issue-by issue analysis somewhere on the internet that seems to have dissappeared.

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A lot of comic fans know the Gold Key series. People that aren't DS purists or even fans of the show.  I've heard people say they don't like the tv series--consider it boring-- but love the Gold Key series. Since the reprints have been coming out, I've seen a few reviews here and there from people who even consider the writing to be in some ways superior to the tv show.
I'll say one thing about the writing on the new comic, I really appreciate Stuart's economy with words. Most comic writers nowadays are egomaniacs and write, write, write and the books are very cluttered and tedious to actually try and read. Stuart strikes exactly the right balance between words and pictures, which is what it's all about with comics.

I bought all the Gold Key books when I was a kid as well. It got worse as the years went on. For the most part, the stories never really jumped the the shark but the art surely did. I got fed up with it as well, but kept buying them. I hoped they would replace Certa at a certain point but they never did. He was about 50 when he started the series and in the last decade of his career. The two volumes of the Hermes series out now represent the book's "golden age." You should check them out. They look much, MUCH better than the old newsprint pamplets. There is still some more good stuff coming up, but it's more hit and miss.

I know which panel you refer to about Julia. I read in one of Aaron's interviews that he shoots his own photos in some cases. I'm sort of on the fence about his Barnabas so far. It's kind of an idealized Frid but doesn't have the swing and bounce and drama of Certa at his best! Oh well, these things aren't really competing with each other.

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But, glad to hear you enjoy what he produced.  It's nice to know that there's a fan out there for every artist.

LOL, well I think he has more than one fan , G. I hear the Hermes Press reprints are quite the hit!

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michael--Angelique (and briefly, Cassandra--I think only in issue 1) was also featured in the Gold Key comics.  Or rather, some garish shrieking thing that was called Angelique because Joe Certa couldn't draw real people to save his soul...

Aaron Campbell's rendition of Angeligue in the dream sequence in the new book is actually worse. Far uglier than anything Certa drew of Angelique. His inking style too, is a bit off putting, sometimes he seems to be using tooth picks or match heads.  Overall I like the art in the new book, my favorite panel being Julia approaching the old house. Usually I don't like comics that rely heavily on photos and trying to capture actors' likenesses. It seems cheesy and a betrayal of the comics medium's strengths. In this case however, I'm going along with it because I'm such a fan of the source material.

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