DARK SHADOWS FORUMS

Members' Mausoleum => Calendar Events / Announcements Archive => Calendar Events / Announcements '24 I => Calendar Events / Announcements '02 II => Topic started by: joe integlia on October 17, 2002, 09:15:26 PM

Title: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: joe integlia on October 17, 2002, 09:15:26 PM
in a review on www.barnesandnoble.com
for the mpi video for the 30th anniversary tribute, david nahmod has posted a negative review of the video but its more about fandom.
calling ds fans lap dogs that drool over the stars. such other claims r made about the fans having no lives and the stars r all has-beens etc.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Dr. Eric Lang on October 17, 2002, 09:30:01 PM
I looked but I didn't see it. Do you have the direct link to that page?
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Gothick on October 17, 2002, 09:52:44 PM
That name, David Nahmod, is familiar for some reason or other.  Have you run across him in the past, Joe?

It's too bad the 30th anniversary video was singled out by this character.  It's probably the best produced of all the MPI specialty videos--certainly the best of the ones I have seen.

Best wishes,  Steve
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: LoveAtFirstBITE on October 17, 2002, 10:18:43 PM
You have to wonder why someone who posts something like that would even care in the first place.  
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 17, 2002, 11:14:53 PM
Quote
That name, David Nahmod, is familiar for some reason or other

Steve, his name might be familiar to you because he directed Louis Edmonds in "Next Year in Jerusalem" and I think he has written about DS in publications.  His feelings and reactions regarding some of the more negative incidents involving fans were also posted on the forum when it was on VNet.  He's also a registered cousin, or at least he registered but hasn't yet officially joined us.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Gothick on October 17, 2002, 11:17:49 PM
Thanks for that reminder, Fran.  These sentiments seem kind of odd from Mr. Nahmod, if he's a fan himself.

You just have to wonder.  

Steve
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: joe integlia on October 18, 2002, 12:13:40 AM
the direct link is too long and too many characters/numbers in the address for me to do it correctly and i cant or dont kow how to do cut and paste on webtv. maybe someone else here can do it. otherwise u have to select video and then enter dark shadows into their search engine. yes david nahmod is a friend of mine and has posted here before and hes directed the video mentioned and wrote for various magazines. he needs to vent his frustrations with fandom. 1 of his posts to a fan webpage has caused her to close her guestbook. what power!
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Julianka7 on October 18, 2002, 12:58:43 AM
Quote
the direct link is too long and too many characters/numbers in the address for me to do it correctly and i cant or dont kow how to do cut and paste on webtv. maybe someone else here can do it. otherwise u have to select video and then enter dark shadows into their search engine. yes david nahmod is a friend of mine and has posted here before and hes directed the video mentioned and wrote for various magazines. he needs to vent his frustrations with fandom. 1 of his posts to a fan webpage has caused her to close her guestbook. what power!


What does he have against fandom?

Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 18, 2002, 01:11:05 AM
Quote
he needs to vent his frustrations with fandom.

I've never argued with David on his point that there are problems in fandom, and while meeting him I found his frustration to be palpable.  The theme of one of his previous posts, as I recall, was that there's room for some fans to treat each other better.  But I question his tack of attacking all DS fans and actors in order to draw attention to the issues that plague him personally.

Quote
1 of his posts to a fan webpage has caused her to close her guestbook. what power!

Personally, I don't think that's anything to brag about, but speaking as a moderator, the problems that have occurred on other DS sites aren't allowed as a topic for conversation here:

6. The negative discussion of other DS forums is to be avoided. In other words, no finger pointing.


And as I've explained to David in the past, no names of actors or fans may be given here if he should decide to again take up airing any of his personal grievances about fandom.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Dr. Eric Lang on October 18, 2002, 01:39:38 AM
Here's the direct link:

http://video.barnesandnoble.com/search/product.asp?WRK=5540441&userid=32LENJF1H5

This guy has some serious issues.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Mark Rainey on October 18, 2002, 02:19:46 AM
Sweeping generalizations are usually very inaccurate or patently untrue. And vitriolic outbursts like this one, which offers nothing but subjective views tainted by an obviously negative experience, belong on Live Journal or--dare I say it--some unmoderated newsgroup, assuming it's necessary to devote the time to articulating it in the first place. Being anything but an objective commentary, it says an awful lot more about the writer than the video or the individuals on the video.

[shadow=black,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]

--A professional writer with an obviously failed life who lives in a fog-bound dream world.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Joeytrom on October 18, 2002, 02:23:32 AM
I am a friend of David's and he is right in reference to the fans.

I find it impossible to talk to anyone at the fests as they want to be alone or with their clique of friends.  It's like "Who are you to come to talk to me?"  I have been to the NY fests since 1995 and have not been able to talk to anyone in regards to DS, there is a lot of cold shoulder going on.

Some fans use the fests as a cruising area too.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: The Ghost of Sarah Collins on October 18, 2002, 02:44:27 AM
I have read this person's grievances concerning Dark Shadows Fandom and believe this person had been injured from his personal experience... of which everyone would agree is unfortunate... although I also believe the only avenue for him, in my opinion is for him to face those who caused him his pain to begin with and not air anyone's soiled linen so to speak in a public or private forum.  

I, as a enthusiast of Dark Shadows have limited experience with said fandom,  I am, I suppose very fortunate in that everyone I have met during a Dark Shadows festival have been kind, caring, intelligent individuals with a normal liking for DS, they have real lives, they are real people, I respect every one of them.

I do not know how others may perceive this person, I do however believe I shall treat him with great caution.

Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: The Ghost of Sarah Collins on October 18, 2002, 03:02:58 AM
Quote
I am a friend of David's and he is right in reference to the fans.

I find it impossible to talk to anyone at the fests as they want to be alone or with their clique of friends.  It's like "Who are you to come to talk to me?"  I have been to the NY fests since 1995 and have not been able to talk to anyone in regards to DS, there is a lot of cold shoulder going on.

Some fans use the fests as a cruising area too.



I do hope  you will attend the 2004 Dark Shadows fest held in California, I shall be in attendance and would love to discuss your views regarding any aspect of the shows performers, favorite story lines, scenes or just enjoy the fest! I enjoy volunteering so some time is devoted to that although while off duty I simply like watching everyone enjoy themselves with the occasional hello here and there from friends rushing by to the dealers room or another activities.  

Should you attend the 2004 fest I will most likely be the volunteer Sarah.

I hope to see you there!

Ps... I do not believe in cruising area's  
Dark Shadows is a festival not the dating game! <G>
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Craig_Slocum on October 18, 2002, 03:12:52 AM
Quote


Some fans use the fests as a cruising area too.


I think the locals are worse than the fans, people who live or work in the area, who are not attending the Fest, but go there looking for someone to get together with.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Gerard on October 18, 2002, 03:38:01 AM
The generalizations this gentleman made in his "review" are, of course, just that.  He basically pegged the performers as has-beens.  Several of them and others involved in DS went on to be either nominated for, or have won, Oscars, Emmys and Tonys.  

But one still wonders about the reason, since he was, at least before, a fan of the show.  Something obviously happened to him, and it seems that it occured at one of the fests (I've never been to one).  Undoubtedly, most who go have a wonderful time with the other fans, but I'm sure there are those occasional times when the one is picked by the thorn rather than experiencing the aroma of the rose.

We can all say from the intellect that one should not judge from one bad experience, and it's easy to say that, but when it happens, the emotions take over and that's understandable.  That's human nature.  And then there is a tendency to exaggerate the affair.  Sadly, for some, such a negative experience can not only turn one off from those who share the interest, but from the interest itself.  It becomes too painful, as the interest is now associated with those who did not behave in a more friendly or civilized manner.

We should maybe take that into account with regards to this gentleman.  Something did happen, and it hurt him to cause such a reaction.

Gerard
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Nancy on October 18, 2002, 04:00:14 AM
Quote
The generalizations this gentleman made in his "review" are, of course, just that.  He basically pegged the performers as has-beens.  Several of them and others involved in DS went on to be either nominated for, or have won, Oscars, Emmys and Tonys.  



It's interesting the term "has-beens" isn't it? I've never really understood what the term meant.  If it refers to the fact that once time popular actors are not popular or don't work as actors anymore, that's a pretty limited and shallow view of the world.  Few people have a professional life that is consistently successful and most actors who do work in the business are never known at all ever to the general public.  Yet they will consider themselves very successful because they do work in their field or have at least had the experience in having some success in an enormously difficult and competitive field.  I think being able to work in one's chosen field at all is a great accomplishment, especially given the degree of difficulty in the arts.

Nobody is ever a "has been."  The talent is there and if that performer was able to touch even one person in a special way, it makes them forever memorable.

nancy
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: dom on October 18, 2002, 04:27:16 AM
Quote
Sweeping generalizations are usually very inaccurate or patently untrue. And vitriolic outbursts like this one, which offers nothing but subjective views tainted by an obviously negative experience, belong on Live Journal or--dare I say it--some unmoderated newsgroup, assuming it's necessary to devote the time to articulating it in the first place. Being anything but an objective commentary, it says an awful lot more about the writer than the video or the individuals on the video.


Well stated, Mark.

Personally, I found the review extremely unprofessional & uninformative. Unfortunately, many nonprofessional (internet) reviewers have a hidden (or not so hidden) agenda.

Dom
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Gerard on October 18, 2002, 04:38:46 AM
Quote



It's interesting the term "has-beens" isn't it? I've never really understood what the term meant.  If it refers to the fact that once time popular actors are not popular or don't work as actors anymore, that's a pretty limited and shallow view of the world.  Few people have a professional life that is consistently successful and most actors who do work in the business are never known at all ever to the general public.  Yet they will consider themselves very successful because they do work in their field or have at least had the experience in having some success in an enormously difficult and competitive field.  I think being able to work in one's chosen field at all is a great accomplishment, especially given the degree of difficulty in the arts.

Nobody is ever a "has been."  The talent is there and if that performer was able to touch even one person in a special way, it makes them forever memorable.

nancy


Well said, Nancy.  I always take the opportunity, if I find a DS performer/participant's website with the ability to send a message to congratulate them on their fine work, both past and present, and to tell them how grateful I am for making my youth so much more marvelous by enjoying all they did back then.

Gerard
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Stuart on October 18, 2002, 04:38:52 AM
Without wishing to be too blunt, I think the author of that review needs to look more to himself than fandom at large.  

If he's so much better than the people he apparently condenscends upon in his ludicrous writings, he'd have better things to do with his time than post incoherent vitriol to a disinterested general audience.

Seriously -- let it go.  Life's too short and it's getting beyond the joke.  If you feel so superior to these people then why are you so badly and desperately craving their acknowledgement and attention?  It's pointless...

And never write off someone as a has-been unless you've actually "been" in the first place ;)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Raineypark on October 18, 2002, 04:56:24 AM
I sincerely hope he's not under the impression that vituperative insults like "tragic people living in a fog bound dream world"  "mainly repressed nerdy types" and "having lived failed lives" are going to make him any more popular at the fests....?!?

Raineypark
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Joeytrom on October 18, 2002, 04:58:52 AM
I am a friend of David's and he is not a troll!  I have been posting here as Joeytrom and Collins1796 so you can see I have never posted anything "trolllike".  Here is an example of what he refers to:
__________________________________________________________

There was a longtime DS fan/fest organizer who ran a Zine from 1985 to 1991.  He was good friends with a lot of the fest organizers until they started to torment him.

This is from the final issue of that zine #7 (January 1991):

Sadly there are a handful of people in fandom who do not want the EHS to continue.  This list is very short, but prestigious. I will not print their names but most of you know them without being told.  They are the people who dominate Dark Shadows fandom in a way no other fandom in America is dominated; who have a hand in virtually everything and seem determined to discredit or destroy anything they don't control.  They are the reason why half then prominent long time DS fans have dropped out of fandom, and why half of those who remain are bristling with bitter accusations.  They are the reason this magazine has taken so long to appear.

I have personally watched as members of this clique tried to stop us from securing interviews, disrupted an interview in progress and tried to bar us from convention space.  I have seen a letter to others on fandom warning to avoid associating with us and have listened for years as fans across the country advised me of false and malicious rumors being spread about the Sentinel's staff.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Maria_Merriweather on October 18, 2002, 05:10:05 AM
I read this person's review on the Barnes and Noble website. I was very offended by the reference to the stars  and fans of DS as "tragic people with failed lives". If he wanted to make points about rude or unfriendly people at the fests he could have done that without insulting the stars and fans. As stated before by another poster the review had little to do with the 30th Anniversary video. It seems to me that this is someone who wants to make trouble and I too would steer clear of this person.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Bernie on October 18, 2002, 06:17:33 AM
Well, I occasionally read the DS newsgroup, and there doesn't seem to be a dimes worth of difference between David's comments and some of those posted
by the trolls there.  I don't know why a tribute film should present it's subjects as has beens, all though, no doubt even the greatest of DS players would probably pale in comparison to the world renown Mr. Nahmod.

Sounds like he's bitter, and perhaps he shares some, or many of the same traits as the DS fans he likes to put down.  Whatever.  In any case, I'm not much a fan of generalizations, whether they emanate from the likes of Mr. Nahmod, or from some sheet wearing bigot who burns crosses.

From personal experience, all I can say is that some of the nicest, most intelligent, and interesting people I know are DS fans who are involved in lists and other DS related activities.

Bernie
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 18, 2002, 07:03:38 AM
Let's PLEASE not attack the fan that wrote the review.

We're here to discuss all aspects of DS, of which fandom is a part, and that includes debating differing opinions.  But these forums are not a vehicle for attacking other fans.

As I said before, I agree that fan behavior can be problematic; HUMAN behavior can be problematic, and David has the right to express his opinions about fan behavior.  He has never trolled on this forum, and since we've already established that any problem he may have been involved in on other forums isn't an appropriate subject for conversation here, simply because he wrote a review that we might strongly disagree with doesn't make him a troll.

Agree or disagree with his opinion, but no more attacks or name calling.  Period.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: joe integlia on October 18, 2002, 11:54:03 AM
thanks joeytrom for reminding me and bringing to everyones attention the EHS fanzine letter. then theres the southern california ds club presidents war with the festival and before that the shadowcon presidents war with the festival. so this has been going on for 20 years now.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Nancy on October 18, 2002, 05:12:52 PM
I agree with Midnite that everyone should be free to discuss the positive and negative aspects of fandom. However, obviously with the many repeat customers the festival has enjoyed for all these years, clearly the differences some fans have with each other is not a major issue.  I'm sure it is for some more than others if something directly impacts them but unfortunately the reality is the kind of crap that does go on is usually between the same people.  It's not a widespead problem.

I said this elsewhere: is it really such big news that people fight with each other?  Nothing that has been described here is peculiar to DS fandom. Nothing.  My primary interests have been in history and politics and for years I've been involved in forums and organizations and there are always the same group of people at odds with each other (and sometimes with everyone else) and there are always people who will complain about things that happened years ago giving the impression that it's still happening, when it's not.  People argue and fight, they can be ridiculous and petty. That happens everywhere.  It's not some special DS problem.
I'm sure I am not the only person here who has been extensively involved with other large groups of people over the years, and have seen this kind of thing go.

I have known people who were long time attendees of different conventions and every one of them who has ever attended a DS festival claimed it was more friendly and filled with less drama than what they had witnessed elsewhere.  I should add that these same people I'm talking about attended more than one DS festival so they were able to make the comparison over time.  Naturally, one convention may be more or less than another for a number of reasons.

I do wonder about the logic of complaining about fans being mean to one another and at the same time publicly ridicule fans in general.  If you object to cruelity and pettiness in others, then obviously object to it because you don't engage in it yourself, right?  

There isn't anyone in fandom you can prevent any person from contacting one of the actors for an interview or whatever.   Even if the actor doesn't act anymore, you can go through the unions to have a letter sent, or go through the unions to get a contact number.  The actors are very aware of DS BS and tend to make their own decisions and steer clear of any nonsense.   If that actor doesn't respond to a letter, then it was the actor's decision to not respond.  I have known several people who got in touch with actors for interviews and other projects and never once approached anyone known in fandom for their help.  
So nobody in fandom has that kind of power (except maybe in their own mind. [lghy]


Nancy
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Miss_Winthrop on October 18, 2002, 05:22:02 PM
Quote
Here's the direct link:

http://video.barnesandnoble.com/search/product.asp?WRK=5540441&userid=32LENJF1H5

This guy has some serious issues.


And this individual is suggesting that DS fans get a life?  Well buddy, this is the life that I've chosen to have and I'm liking every minute of it!
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Craig_Slocum on October 18, 2002, 07:10:36 PM
Quote


If you object to cruelity and pettiness in others, then obviously object to it because you don't engage in it yourself, right?


I agree, but there are those who can provoke even the "angels". Luckily those people are few, compared to all the nice ones in fandom. If I felt so badly about the stars and the fans, I would just leave fandom, why be miserable and make others miserable?    

Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: yendor on October 18, 2002, 09:48:24 PM
The difference between fandom "now" and fandom "way back when" has more to do with proximity than anything else. In the old days, we were all pretty much isolated from one another...so we were definitely less likely to "fight" and throw star fits. Our connection developed because of the show and its sundry fan clubs. Speaking for myself, I corresponded with people like Bob Finocchio and Dot Money (now Dee Kearney), and we had a thriving little network going. But we rarely even spoke on the phone. Feelings and sensibilities are less likely to be hurt when your relationship is limited to letter-writing (and I mean REAL letters, too--not e-mails!).

Fandom is a whole different ball game now, from what I can gather. That's ok, though. Things develop, they go through stages, and it's all part of the glorious process of maturation. There's always a downside...but the heights are so exhilerating, they make those negatives look like gentle speed bumps.

So, I think the critic of DS fandom has every right to express his opinion. And we, as people who obviously enjoy and appreciate the show, should accept his experiences as legit. Frankly, I'm sorry he feels that way...but I won't stoop to calling him names or dismissing his views as insignificant.

As for the comment about being a "has-been," we've all pretty much heard that stuff before--and not necessarily about Dark Shadows. I remember a friend of mine who was laughing about a singer (BJ Thomas) who was "reduced" (his words) to appearing at county fairs. "Can you imagine?" my friend sniffed rather imperiously, "that guy actually had several #1 records! What a has-been!" My response floored him. "Yes, he has had several #1 records...and that meant BJ Thomas was the MOST POPULAR singer in America while his records were at the top. That's a significant achievement, in my opinion. Do you have anything in YOUR life that could even touch it?"  Well, my buddy was speechless. No, of course he had no such achievement.

So, there's no such thing as a "has-been." The folks on Dark Shadows achieved something very few (if any) of us will ever achieve. Within their collective lifetimes, they were part of an International phenomenon--something that will continue to thrill, entertain, and mesmerize generations. That, to me, is a definite ACHIEVEMENT.

I'll step off my soapbox, now. Hope this makes sense!

Rod
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Philippe Cordier on October 20, 2002, 02:13:59 AM
I actually *do* live in a tragic, fog-bound dreamworld (note my choice of quote for my profile) ...

But my experience at two festivals has been very positive.  No, not everyone I've met has jumped at the chance to get to know me better ... but that's no different than one would expect to find anywhere.  I've actually found it much easier to strike up a conversation with strangers at the festivals than I have many other places -- churches, bars, or any other pickup place.

O.K., I was kidding a bit with that last comment.

The nature of the acting field, especially in Hollywood, is that there are always new actors and stars breaking in every day, so the market obviously cannot keep everyone at the same level of popularity.  Nancy makes the point, too, that the majority of working actors (and, actually, at any given time the majority of actors probably are NOT working) are not in the limelight. The term "has-been" is inappropriate, IMO.

Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Annie on October 20, 2002, 02:45:54 AM
Dear Midnite who are we talking about here?
Whose David???  I hope i don't have to kick myself
for this Question anne who just came in on all
this.             Love Anne
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Misty on October 20, 2002, 02:54:47 AM
Obviously this person has stirred up a hornet's nest. Personally, I take no offense to any unfavorable comments about DS fans. Why would I even care?? I enjoy being, and connecting with other fans (internationally, I might add). I fully intend to be at the NY fest (my first) next year, and I fully intend to enjoy myself with or without input from others. Life's too short to be concerned about the negativity of one or two persons.

                                  Misty
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Connie on October 20, 2002, 03:32:59 AM
Quote
Dear Midnite who are we talking about here?
Whose David???  I hope i don't have to kick myself
for this Question


Aw...hey!  Don't KICK yourself.  I don't know who David is either.  LOL

love
CLC  :'(    
(Who has absolutely no life whatsoever but DOES live in some sort of romantic fantasy world filled with tragedy and despair)


"I drink, therefore I am."
       -Quentin Collins
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 20, 2002, 03:44:07 AM
Quote
Whose David???

Hi Annie,

He wrote the review on the Barnes & Noble website.  You can get to it via Dr. Eric Lang's post at the bottom of this topic's page 1.

It's no problem, dear.  You can ask about anything you don't understand. :D

Connie, you're too much! ;)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: MsCriseyde on October 20, 2002, 06:01:22 AM
I think Connie and Annie would agree that there is only one David with whom we need to concern ourselves. :-*

Incidentally, the whole stereotype of fans being perpetuated by the review in question has actually been debunked by numerous ethnographic explorations of fandom, including Henry Jenkins' Textual Poachers and Camille Bacon-Smith's Enterprising Women. There's also a collection of essays called Theorizing Fandom that includes a piece on Dark Shadows fans and their fan fiction.

I'm sure Barnes & Noble also sells these titles. ;)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Cassandra on October 20, 2002, 10:01:51 AM
Quote
Dear Midnite who are we talking about here?
Whose David???  I hope i don't have to kick myself
for this Question anne who just came in on all
this.             Love Anne



Hi Annie,  You don't have to worry,  it's not your David! :-)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Connie on October 20, 2002, 01:22:11 PM
Quote
I think Connie and Annie would agree that there is only one David with whom we need to concern ourselves. :-*


Damned straight!

-CLC

Hobnobbing with a Semi-Famous Has-Been (whom I love)  LOL

(http://members.aol.com/clchalifoux/images/hobnob.jpg)

:-*  [thumb]  :-*
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: jennifer on October 20, 2002, 03:50:26 PM
hey Connie you're cute!

as for this i intend to go to the fest in NY next  year and have a good time ! hey people fight in groups all the time in fact if i join a group and no one disagrees(or at least one person acts nasty) i get nervous.I hate to say it but some people love to be in control and act nasty
i just tend to write them off. just went through it with a group down at my parent's condo down the Cape.
Hey i have a life and wouldn't it be fun to be a "has Been" i also agree that david ? has a right to his views and if he wants to join here would say go for it!we're a pretty friendly group and welcome disagreements.
jennifer
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Mark Rainey on October 20, 2002, 05:36:46 PM
There's often a double standard regarding "has-beens." True, many people think of an entertainer who is no longer in the limelight as a has-been. On the other hand, if the entertainer hangs on to the top spots year after year, people consider him or her a dinosaur ("He's been around forever. Shouldn't he have retired by now?").

--Mark

(Wondering whatever happened to Engelbert Humperdinck...)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Mark Rainey on October 20, 2002, 05:39:36 PM
PS -- It's always nice to see pictures of stars like Connie looking so glamorous. But who's that scuzzy-looking chap hanging off of her arm?

--Mark
[/b][/color]
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Nancy on October 20, 2002, 06:19:00 PM
Quote
There's often a double standard regarding "has-beens." True, many people think of an entertainer who is no longer in the limelight as a has-been. On the other hand, if the entertainer hangs on to the top spots year after year, people consider him or her a dinosaur ("He's been around forever. Shouldn't he have retired by now?").

--Mark

(Wondering whatever happened to Engelbert Humperdinck...)


Englebert Whats-his-dink?

Seriously though, I was quite surprised to discover after I moved to New York that many actors I thought had died since I did not see them in movies or on TV had been working for years in the theater, touring around the country but making their home base in New York. Jean Stapleton for example has done a few TV things since AITF but has consistently been working in the theater by her own choice. Sure, it's less money but people in the arts are willing to do that because they love what they do.  I also found out there were so many one shot wonder singers or singers with short careers who preferred the behind the scenes part of the business writing songs and producing records as opposed to constant touring and the pressure of that life. Some people love the touring scene (which is how singers make their big money) but others dislike the life and quit.  You never know until you are there and in the business doing it whether you will like it or not.

Since the media doesn't cover the theater, someone you loved from TV or films could have this very productive stage career going and you wouldn't know it unless you read the trades.

Nancy
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Annie on October 20, 2002, 06:58:52 PM
WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!  CONNIE THAT PHOTO OF THE Q-MAN
YUMMY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THOSE BLUE JEANS HE LOOKS GORGEOUS IN THEM!!!
Help Anne is losing control wait till her Q-man starts
to talk then she'll be headed for WinCliff!!!
Thanks Midnite too for the info!  Also, to Jennifer
and Criseyde    You guys are great!
                  Love Anne
Nice Pic of you too connie!
                                   
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 20, 2002, 07:44:19 PM
Wow, I didn't recognize Connie without the drawn beard and dark sunglasses. [wink2]

Cute pic!
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: jennifer on October 20, 2002, 07:47:21 PM

Quote
Wondering whatever happened to Engelbert Humperdinck...)


he is still around as nancy said they still tour or do shows i was surprized to see David Cassidy has a great career going in Vegas
jennifer
hey Midnite went back to take picture of Connie and the q man off my post saw it was gone did you do it? Thanks you're fast girl!
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Midnite on October 20, 2002, 07:51:07 PM
Quote
hey Midnite went back to take picture of Connie and the q man off my post saw it was gone did you do it? Thanks you're fast girl!

Oops, guilty as charged. ::)

You're welcome, and thanks! :D
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Gerard on October 20, 2002, 09:05:24 PM
Quote
WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!  CONNIE THAT PHOTO OF THE Q-MAN
YUMMY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THOSE BLUE JEANS HE LOOKS GORGEOUS IN THEM!!!
Help Anne is losing control wait till her Q-man starts
to talk then she'll be headed for WinCliff!!!


Anne!  Control yourself!  There are ladies (and gentlemen) here, who are now blushing!  Just teasing!  I know if I ever saw TLATKLS in person, I'd become a blabbering, heart-thumping-in-chest schoolboy madly in love, and then hit the floor in a dead faint.  Can you imagine, Anne, if you and I were in a room at the same time when the Q-Man and TLATKLS entered together?  We'd probably shatter the windows!

Gerard
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Connie on October 21, 2002, 11:29:43 AM
Quote
PS -- It's always nice to see pictures of stars like Connie looking so glamorous. But who's that scuzzy-looking chap hanging off of her arm?


A guy I picked up in a bar.

-CLC   [wavey]
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Annie on October 21, 2002, 07:20:17 PM
Hi,Gerard i'll try not to make you guys and gals
blush so much!!! I know your'e just teasing it's
cute!!!   I'll try to control myself  !!  Do hope i
can get to the DS Fest next yr in the Summer!
              Love Anne
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: ProfStokes on October 22, 2002, 07:48:17 AM
First of all, I'm not exactly sure why Nahmod's article was even advertised on this forum.  Clearly it was bound to stir up controversy and provoke tempers.  Why get into all of that?  

Quote
I find it impossible to talk to anyone at the fests as they want to be alone or with their clique of friends.


Everybody that I've ever met at a DS event has been quite friendly; however, I have seen fans who tend to stick in defined groups.  I don't interpret their behavior as deliberately rude though.  As I see it, these people have known each other for a long time and are accustomed to socializing with one another.  I love to meet new people at these events, but when I go to a Festival, I naturally want to see my friends and find out what's going on in their lives as well.  It's generally easier to be around people whom one has known for a few years than those met a few hours earlier.  Rather than feeling slighted or discouraged, I feel more determined to continue my participation in fandom and even to broaden it.  It takes time and patience to find a niche, but from what I've seen, the effort pays off in valuable friendships further down the line.  This is just my opinion of course, but I do hope that you'll give the fans another chance.

ProfStokes
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: victoriawinters on October 22, 2002, 08:40:12 AM
Quote
Everybody that I've ever met at a DS event has been quite friendly; however, I have seen fans who tend to stick in defined groups....It's generally easier to be around people whom one has known for a few years than those met a few hours earlier.  Rather than feeling slighted or discouraged, I feel more determined to continue my participation in fandom and even to broaden it.  


thanks for your invaluable insight prof. stokes.  i too have recently come into the fold of ds fandom, particularly on the internet and and then my first fest this year.  i do not notice that i am particularly excluded from speaking with people, on the contrary, i have been able to walk up to folks and say hi.

i hope to get to know more people later as time goes by.

as for englebert humperdick, i believe the opera composer of hansel and gretel is dead.  

as for the other one, he is currently still touring if you can believe it.  here is a web page for him....

http://www.engelbert.net/concert.htm

Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: joe integlia on October 22, 2002, 10:28:35 AM
yes, of course the review topic was posted here to stir u guys up and start a discussion. this is a discussion board after all.
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: Bobubas on October 23, 2002, 07:39:55 AM
Quote
There's often a double standard regarding "has-beens." True, many people think of an entertainer who is no longer in the limelight as a has-been. On the other hand, if the entertainer hangs on to the top spots year after year, people consider him or her a dinosaur  


On the upside of the "has been" label, I have come up with this phrase I often use to describe talented ex-athletes. I think it can apply here as well :)

You can't be a "has been" if you were a "never was" ;)
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: jennifer on October 23, 2002, 10:53:22 PM
Quote


Anne!  Control yourself!  There are ladies (and gentlemen) here, who are now blushing!  Just teasing!  I know if I ever saw TLATKLS in person, I'd become a blabbering, heart-thumping-in-chest schoolboy madly in love, and then hit the floor in a dead faint.  Can you imagine, Anne, if you and I were in a room at the same time when the Q-Man and TLATKLS entered together?  We'd probably shatter the windows!

Gerard


Throw in Don B and the earth would shake!Steve and i would have to be sedated!

jennifer
Title: Re: unfavorable D.S. review
Post by: VAM on October 24, 2002, 01:24:35 AM
Quote


Nobody is ever a "has been."  The talent is there and if that performer was able to touch even one person in a special way, it makes them forever memorable.

nancy


Superficial statement rendered and Nancy replies with an awesome answer![thumb]