DARK SHADOWS FORUMS

General Discussions => Current Talk Archive => Current Talk '24 I => Current Talk '02 I => Topic started by: Luciaphile on May 14, 2002, 03:22:10 PM

Title: Professor of what?
Post by: Luciaphile on May 14, 2002, 03:22:10 PM
I don't think it's ever said exactly what T. Eliot Stokes is a professor of.

Yeah, yeah, he's got the interest in the occult, but generally speaking those people aren't advisors of graduate students studying to be teachers.  Since Cassandra tells us she was studying to be a "teacher," that lets out anything in the professorial field (five minutes in the groves of academe and she would know the difference, it's that ingrained), so presumably she was pursuing a career as a secondary school teacher.  I can't see him in the Education department, and I suppose she could be getting a subject Masters . . .

So where does that place him?  History?  English?  He doesn't go into the field so not anthropology or archaeology.  

Any ideas?

Luciaphil
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Raineypark on May 14, 2002, 03:35:07 PM
Sociology.....that was a required course at my university and a catch-all, "What the hell?" course of study if I ever saw one!!

Rainey
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: The charming Mr. Blair on May 14, 2002, 04:47:25 PM
My guess: T. Eliot Stokes, Professor of Semiology.
I see him as a man who has made a study of reading signs and omens in varioius states of nature -- whether it is the contrast of shadows as the morning suns reflects off the Old House, or the nuances in the sounds of the birds in the trees surrounding Collinwood. Professor Stokes is attune with the metaphysical aspects of reality.   ;)
He may, very well be able to answer Julia Hoffman's great retorical question, "What does this mean"? ?!?
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Gothick on May 14, 2002, 05:34:51 PM
Luciaphil, My own sense is that stokes is a plain old Professor of English.  In the old days, people who did English often had all sorts of "esoteric" side interests--think of Dame Frances Yates, for instance.  

He taught at Rockport College, which I seriously doubt had anything like a real grad program.  Cassandra was probably pretending to go for some sort of teaching certificate.  Don't forget btw that Cassandra lies more naturally than she combs her hair (MUCH more naturally, come to think of it, looking at her hair) AND the poor dear was never terribly competent so we can't expect her story to stand up to much probing.

Best,

Gothick
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Bob_the_Bartender on May 15, 2002, 12:27:40 AM
Hey gang,

I thought that the venerable T. Elliot Stokes was a professor of parapsychology.  (That specific academic program must be as "rigorous" as the one some of my friends had when they were "urban studies" majors in college.  And that's why some of them made "Who's Who" for college academic "excellence.")

You know, I don't believe that we ever learned the actual name of Prof. Stokes' institution of higher learning.  In any event, the school's administration was apparently very liberal in providing the good professor with time off to pursue his supernatural research/investigations.

It would have been great fun to have seen Prof. Stokes lecturing to a class of freshmen students featuring Carolyn Stoddard, Maggie Evans, Harry Johnson, the Eagle Hill Cemetery Caretaker (the school's oldest freshman student!) and the group's class clown, Edwin "Buzz" Hackett!

Sincerely,

Bob the Bartender, who yawns when he recalls those dreary, soporific evening classes (a sure cure for insomnia!).



Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 15, 2002, 02:36:28 AM
I like all of these responses, and I would have loved to have seen Prof. Stokes as an English professor (having pursued a graduate degree in that field myself), but I vote for Bob's professor of parapsychology.

Although English types are certainly very interesting people  ;) , everyone I can think of in the field tended to be rather coldly rational, nonbeliever types.  Yes, I know, I know, there were the Yates and Sayers and Tolkiens and C. S. Lewises, but that was in ages gone by.  (Though they actually were still active in the late 60s, so I guess that's still possible.)

Semiotics -- I think that's the same as what SonofBarnabas refers to -- now that's a great thought, thinking of Umberto Eco with "Foucault's Pendulum," but again I sense a professional distance from the subject that's very different from Stokes' very personal interest (and involvement?) in occult matters.

There were universities back in the 1960s (or at least "research arms" of universities, the best known of which was affiliated with a certain California institution I attended) that had parapsychology departments.  I believe these departments were offshoots of the psychology departments.  That really sounds like the perfect match for Prof. Stokes, though I'm certain he's very knowledgeable about history and all of the liberal arts.

This was a great question and responses to read -- my earlier thoughts were that here was another example of DS "veering off from reality."  But parapsychology actually sounds like a realistic possibility.

Cheers to Prof. Stokes!  What fascinating discussions one might have had over sherry in a tutorial with him ...

(And now back to my own academic assignments ... papers that were actually due for a class last December, but which I've not found time to work on since then  :D )

Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 15, 2002, 02:55:57 AM
I just read through everyone's responses again (more carefully this time) and noticed the mention of Rockport College. That always sounded like a community college sort of place to me; if so, it's doubtful that they would have had a parapsychology research department.  But then, would a community college be able to offer teaching licensure?  Rockport College could be what used to be called a "teachers' college."  Or maybe Cassandra actually is pursuing a higher academic degree; she could still have referred to herself as intending to be a "teacher" -- not everyone is familiar with exactly what someone with a Ph.D. does.

And who knows -- I believe that near-death and historic paranormal researcher Raymond Moody is associated with a very small college somewhere in the South, so it is still possible Prof. Stokes could be in a similar role at a small college in Maine.

?!?
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Linda on May 15, 2002, 02:57:58 AM
Quote
So where does that place him?  History?  English?  He doesn't go into the field so not anthropology or archaeology.  

Any ideas?

History seems the most plausible choice, since it's a pretty broad field.  Time periods and events that he studied might have triggered his interest in other areas -- such as the occult -- and he could have pursued that knowledge independently, simply because he found it intriguing.

Cheers,

Linda
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 15, 2002, 03:57:06 AM
Thinking that the real-life Dr. Raymond Moody, whom I mentioned above, might be a current version of Prof. Stokes, I did some quick checking on Moody.  He originally got his Ph.D. in philosophy and later his medical license and specialization in psychiatry.

Prof. Stokes could conceivably have trained in philosophy, or maybe psychology, and branched off into parapsychology.

Dr. Moody's interest in recent years has been "facilitated communication" with clients wishing to contact their departed loved ones by use of a  psychomanteum, a darkened room with a mirror.  (Actually, that sounds like what some girls in my elementary school tried in the girl's bathroom -- they turned the lights out and swore they saw a shape appear in the mirror.)  The practice is supposed to go back to ancient Greece and Egypt.  I remember reading an article about Moody's Institute in a remote Southern town, which made me think that Stokes could be in a similar role in a small town in Maine.

Stokes obviously is well-known for his expertise in the paranormal regardless of his official academic affiliation.
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 15, 2002, 04:33:28 AM
Quote


I can't see him in the Education department


I can't either.  People in Education Departments are simply not that interesting!

Speaking from experience ...



PLEASE, SOMEONE, STOP ME!!!


-Vlad, King of Procrastinators  [crazd]
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: kuanyin on May 15, 2002, 05:20:05 AM
Quote
Sociology.....that was a required course at my university and a catch-all, "What the hell?" course of study if I ever saw one!!

Rainey


Some how that just sounds perfect to me!
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Bob_the_Bartender on May 15, 2002, 06:00:33 AM
Hey gang,

Maybe Prof. Stokes was a former classmate at some point of Harvard psychiatrist, Dr. Steven Mack, M.D.  You know, the doctor who hypnotizes people to investigate their claims of alien abduction.

Come to think of it, the good Dr. Mack may have been a classmate/colleague of Dr. Julia Hoffman, M.D.  I can just see Julia using that over-sized medallion of hers on some of Dr. Mack's abductees/patients.  

Of course, Dr. Hoffman would also consult with her other colleague, Dr. Eric Lang, about those strange physical marks found on the abductees' bodies after an "encounter" with E.T.'s during some weird surgical procedure conducted somewhere up there in the Pleiades.

Bob the Bartender, who wonders if Agents Sculley and Moulder will have a close encounter of the third kind with "Buzz" Hackett at the conclusion of the X-Files?
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: jennifer on May 15, 2002, 06:40:02 AM
liberal arts!
but i think it is History like Linda!
sometimes i wonder did the writers have some sixth sense about the future and know this show would be
talked about years later so they left a lot of unanswered
questions that we are still debating about years later!
Kinda of like The Jennings brothers some think they were twins , others not, but it is never stated one way or another in the plot!
Makes for a lot of fun debate !

jennifer

Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 16, 2002, 02:57:47 AM
Quote

liberal arts!
but i think it is History like Linda!


I would say history or philosophy over sociology.  Again, Prof. Stokes seems too interesting a character to have devoted his studies to graphs, charts, infrastructures, ethnic data, etc.  Am probably revealing my own bias here as to what's interesting ...

Maybe he majored in history or philosophy as an undergraduate, and then went on to psychology/parapsychology in his graduate and post-graduate work.  Rockford College has given him a small lab and office to pursue psychical research. Cassandra Blair/Collins plans to become a teacher but is also pursuing studies in philosophy and psychology.

If Stokes' background had been in English literature, I would have expect him to have quoted Shakespeare or some other poet by now.  (They could have had him recite "Dover Beach" rather than Roger.)

I just saw Minja's post in the other thread which provides more food for thought. Stokes might well have studied comparative religions -- especially ancient religions, where magical practices played a big part.  I would also expect him to be knowledgeable of mythology (good one, Minja  :) ).  What department did Joseph Campbell teach in at Sarah Lawerence?  Religion?
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 21, 2002, 04:44:15 AM
I thought I had pretty much exhausted my thoughts on the question of what Professor Stokes teaches, but a few lines in last Friday's episode(s) provided more grist for the mill ...

When Stokes forced Barnabas (or was it Julia Hoffman?) to tell him who the witch was, he was both shocked -- and yet not completely surprised -- when he learned that Cassandra Collins is the witch.  "For my own personal reasons," he said (or words to that effect).

What were these personal reasons?  What exactly was their relationship?

It was revealed that Roger Collins met Cassandra at a party at Stokes' house (note: not apartment, as I had assumed in my previous viewing).  It is possible that Stokes is merely Cassandra's academic advisor, but I think there is more to their relationship than that, though this is never explained.

For a number of reasons, I believe that Stokes has attempted to psychoanalyze Cassandra, either formally or informally.  That is why he is both surprised, yet not surprised, to find out that she is a practitioner of witchcraft.  He has seen something hidden in her character that he didn't previously understand, which he had been unable to identify, but now the pieces fit together.

I think the background knowledge of the writers concerning Stokes is that he is trained as a Jungian analyst (in addition to his Ph.D.).

Earlier I explained my rationale for seeing Stokes as a psychologist who has branched off into parapsychology.

The Jungian element would explain his knowledge of dreams, symbolism, and culture in general.  Jungians are extensively involved in art and symbols, myth and religion, and dream analysis.  Like Prof. Stokes, Carl Jung was very open to -- and involved with -- the world of the occult and the supernatural.  Dream interpretation, at least today, is the sole purveyance of Jungian and Freudian analysts in the psychology field (it has pretty much been discounted my mainstream academic psychologists).  There is no evidence that Stokes is a Freudian (no talk about Oedipus complexes, penis envy, etc.  ;D), but he definitely has a Jungian worldview.

Julia stated to Barnabas that she had gone to Stokes because she thought he could help her understand her dream.

Stokes' background as a Jungian psychologist also fits nicely with the whole idea of a dream curse.

(I missed six episodes last week, so I wonder if I missed other important clues.)

*  *  *  *

BTW, the dream curse scans perfectly as poetry -- in fact, it's a little too metrical, resulting in the sing-song quality one finds in much amateur poetry.  The four lines scan as four feet, five feet, four feet, and five feet, regular iambic for the most part, with trochees in the final foot of the first two lines.  The final line wisely varies the regularity of the meter.
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 22, 2002, 02:54:34 AM
Hmm, no feedback on my theories, so I don't know if anyone thinks I'm on the right track or off-the-wall with any of this ...

For better or worse, my ideas continue to evolve (like when I'm at work or trying to get to bed -- actually, sleep deprivation might explain a lot  :D).

I can't quite decide now if the writers had in mind that Professor Stokes was a Jungian theorist, or if they might even have been loosely basing him on Carl Jung.

The reason this latter idea came to mind was that I realized another specific point of comparison between them:  Jung was deeply involved with the I-Ching ... and as we will later learn, T.E. Stokes is, too.

And I'm wondering -- just speculating at this point -- if Stokes' understanding of Parallel Time (... in a future storyline... ) might relate to Jung's theory of synchronicity. I only have a basic understanding of synchronicity and don't really know what the underpinnings of the theory are, but something makes me wonder if parallel universes might enter into it.

I have a biography of Jung that would probably have the answers, but I haven't had time to read it.

-Vlad
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Thom on May 22, 2002, 06:32:41 AM
Eliot is a psychiatrist from what I recall of a 1969 eppy after 1897 ends. We learn the fate of Sabrina Stuart whose hair has gone prematurely gray. Eliot is taking over the patients of 'Dr. Reeves' while Sabrina is at a nursing home.
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Luciaphile on May 22, 2002, 10:20:46 PM
Wow, quite a few suggestions here!  After reading all of them, I'm inclined to go with English as Eliot's subject.  It would allow him to dabble in a variety of subfields.  No way could I see him as a philosopher.  History might work . . . but not philosophy and he's just not the type for psychology (I speak from personal experience here too ;) )  But I guess the nice thing in that it's never been defined is that it's so open for speculation.

Luciaphil
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Happybat on May 22, 2002, 11:15:16 PM
Quote
Hmm, no feedback on my theories, so I don't know if anyone thinks I'm on the right track or off-the-wall with any of this ...

I can't quite decide now if the writers had in mind that Professor Stokes was a Jungian theorist, or if they might even have been loosely basing him on Carl Jung.

The reason this latter idea came to mind was that I realized another specific point of comparison between them:  Jung was deeply involved with the I-Ching ... and as we will later learn, T.E. Stokes is, too.


I have a biography of Jung that would probably have the answers, but I haven't had time to read it.

-Vlad


Dear Professor Vlad (sorry, I can't resist that!)  ;)

No, you're not off-the-wall at all!  I found myself nodding as I read your astute analysis of Prof. Stokes' possible academic leanings.  Although it has been eons since I took that one psychology course, I do recall enough about Carl Jung to agree with you.  If one remembers anything at all about Jung, it is his ideas about archetypes which DS is certainly full of.  What I didn't know was that Jung used I Ching wands - very interesting!  

Yes, I believe that much of Freud (and, I would imagine, Jung as well) has been discounted recently, although I often find Jung's view of the human psyche more convincing than Freud's obsession with sex.  

As for Prof. Stokes, he has long been one of my favorite characters - right up there with Barnabas, Julia and Angelique.  I often view him as the voice of reason in the often chaotic and nightmarish world of Dark Shadows.  It is reasonable to assume that he came to parapsychology from psychology, although I would envision him also as an expert in folklore and mythology, which again would relate back to Jung.  

Can't you just imagine Prof. Stokes in his own show, investigating cases of hauntings, curses, and other strange paranormal phenomena?  At the end of each episode, he would return to his well-worn armchair and sip sherry by firelight!  

Now, back to work, Vlad!!   [wavey]
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Daphne on May 23, 2002, 02:43:23 AM
Vlad wrote:
Quote
And I'm wondering -- just speculating at this point -- if Stokes' understanding of Parallel Time (... in a future storyline... ) might relate to Jung's theory of synchronicity. I only have a basic understanding of synchronicity and don't really know what the underpinnings of the theory are, but something makes me wonder if parallel universes might enter into it.


....there's really such thing as parallel time??  :o :o Pishposh....call me Roger Collins, but I don't believe.....there was actually someone who thought so?? KEEEEEEEWL I'm soooo looking 4ward 2 taking Psycology/Sociology next year!!!!!  8) ;D


Happybat wrote:
Quote
Can't you just imagine Prof. Stokes in his own show, investigating cases of hauntings, curses, and other strange paranormal phenomena?  At the end of each episode, he would return to his well-worn armchair and sip sherry by firelight!


Sounds like something from Alfred Hitchcock Presents, lol
Title: Re: Professor of what?
Post by: Philippe Cordier on May 23, 2002, 03:52:18 AM
Quote
Wow, quite a few suggestions here!


Seems you opened a can of worms here, Luciaphil.  ;D

Quote

After reading all of them, I'm inclined to go with English as Eliot's subject.  It would allow him to dabble in a variety of subfields.  


I'm only too happy to be in the same court as Professor Stokes!  It does seem that we English lit types (though I'll speak only for myself) do have wide-ranging interests ...  

But what about Thom's comment that Stokes is identified as a psychiatrist in a later storyline?  I don't remember that at all, but it would seem to confirm my theory.  Could the identification have been somewhat vague, simply suggesting he was a therapist or analyst?  I don't think he's ever referred to as "doctor," which would be necessary if he were a psychiatrist.

But if he's a psychologist or another type of therapist or analyst, he could receive a physician's referrals, as Thom says is the case.

Daphne wrote:
Quote

....there's really such thing as parallel time?Pishposh....call me Roger Collins, but I don't believe.....there was actually someone who thought so??


I don't know about parallel time, but parallel universes are definitely predicted to exist alongside our own in the latest theories of many leading physicists. And if there are parallel universes, it would stand to reason that their time is parallel to ours, too.  Whether these parallel universes are actually like ours (i.e., with people, etc.) is a completely different matter ...

*  *  *

Happybat ... Thank you!  :)

I promise this will be absolutely my last post until I finish that darn final paper!