DARK SHADOWS FORUMS
General Discussions => Current Talk Archive => Current Talk '24 I => Current Talk '08 II => Topic started by: Joeytrom on October 05, 2008, 02:12:28 PM
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There has never been a lot discussed about Jamison's wife. The writers named almost all the Collins generations after the 1795 era but never Liz and Rogers own mother. She was mentioned twice by Elizabeth- when she shows Vicky an heirloom her mother gave her prior to marrying Paul and when she finds a letter her mother wrote to Jamison giving her time of birth.
Probably because she lived at Collinwood during "quiet supernatural" years there isn't much to write about in that regard but has anyone thought of who she was? Probably an outsider to Collinsport or a war bride of Jamisons?
She apparently died after Liz married Paul and obviously before 1966.
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Supposedly, in Art Wallace's original outline for the show, Joseph and Carolyn were Liz and Roger's parents. Carolyn died at age 38 giving birth to Roger and Joseph died three years later. Liz was raised to take over the business and was busy raising a 20 years young brother. Liz married Paul at ag 35 and three years later had Carolyn. This comes from a book called the History of Dark Shadows by Jim Pierson and was of course not totally followed by the shows later writers.
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I was thinking about this same question whilst writing about Victoria Winters' heritage. I own Art Wallace's "Shadows on the Wall," and I believe I had the foresight when I moved recently to bring the box with my Dark Shadows books. I'll try to check into this in a day or two. If Elizabeth and Rogers' parents were originally "Joseph" and "Carolyn," then I don't know how much weight we can give to Art Wallace's story bible in this case.
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I've read a fan fiction where an amnesic Vicki is sent thru time and becomes Liz and Roger's mother. I thought there was a lot of irony there, given Vicki's obsession with her ties to Collinwood. That same story also had Liz being Vicki's mother in a perplexing paradox.
A different fan fiction had Beth Chavez's little sister married to Jamison. That was one pretty disturbing as she had a psychotic hatred of Beth ( who she strongly resembled) , Jamsion had never gotten over his crush of Beth and married the sister because of the resemblence. Beth's sister had killed several infant daughters because they looked like Beth, and only allowed Liz to live because she didn't look like Beth. Jamsion insisted on naming his daughter Elizabeth after Beth.
The show gives us so little information on that time period that there's no real way to know much "canon" info about her. If I were writing a story I'd be tempted to make her Laura Stockbridge lol.
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Those stories sound great, quentincollins.
I think Aunt Katherine in Boston must be a younger sister of the mother of Roger and Elizabeth, if Aunt Katherine was indeed an aunt of the Collinwood folks.
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Woah--I'd somehow never made the connection between Elizabeth and Beth's names. Feeling dumb now. But it makes perfect sense.
I'd bet some fairly odd things happened in Collinwood after 1897 and prior to 1966--not including [spoiler]Paul Stoddard's deal with the Leviathans. One detail I remember hearing somewhere was that Jamison Collins died without passing on the "Collins Secret" to his son Roger. Which begs the question "Why?"[/spoiler]
Makes for some fascinating speculation, though. I quite like the notion of Carolyn named after her grandmother and find myself pondering the lady's history. What did she think, coming to that great old house by the sea? There were plenty of servants at that time is my guess, but one must wonder if perhaps the young Mrs. Jamison Collins might have wandered into the closed-off wing once or twice. Do you suppose she ever glanced into the room of Parallel Time? What might she have seen there? I've always suspected Roger might have had some paranormal experiences in his early youth, events he has denied ever since. If so, how might his mother have been involved?
For that matter, how did Jamison and his bride die?
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In the original timeline, perhaps Edward didn't believe what Edith told him and never mentioned it to Jamison or Jamison didn't believe Edward.
In a 1966 episode, Liz told David her father died over twenty years before (in the 1940's).
Her mother was alive when she married Paul (as she mentioned to Vicky about the heirloom).
Roger did mention to Burke and Dr. Woodard that as a boy he was scared of the Collins legends but outgrew them.
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In regards to Edith and the secret I think it's more likely of one of two things: Edward died before he could tell Jamison the secret or Jamison died before he could tell Roger.
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Where can we find an official family tree (using branches and correct dates, etc.) without having to run around and look for books. Someone must have one. I often wondered about their parents. and also why the family line dwindled. They must have had a very interesting family line (which kept changing as time travel occurred) and i believe that they could have really used the time travel and "story-telling" to go back to different decades. I would loved to have seen the 20's (both real and PT!) that would have been good. 30's and 40's too! such a shame we had to have the lame 1841 parallel time story [hall_rolleyes] as our last glimpse of such a great show.
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http://darkshadows.wikia.com/wiki/The_Collins_Family_Tree
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I would loved to have seen the 20's (both real and PT!) that would have been good. 30's and 40's too! such a shame we had to have the lame 1841 parallel time story [hall_rolleyes] as our last glimpse of such a great show.
While I don't agree that the 1841 PT story was 'lame', I do think that time travel back to the 20's or 30's would have made for some great stories. It would have been interesting to see Elizabeth and Roger as kids, in their teens or young adults.
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the original concept of 1841 was good. but when we were left in 1841 parralell time, i felt that the show just went lame from there. (the excruciating Lottery and who killed (geez, i forgot her name!), and Frid as a non-supernatural creature.....
but, not bad for a five year run, that i only disliked the last storyline
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I thought the lottery storyline was quite fascinating myself. And Jonathan was tired of playing Barnabas at this point of the show. He wished to portray another character. I can't say I blamed him, I mean, everyone else got a chance to play a different character (with the exception of David Selby who only played anyone by the name of Quentin and Alexandra Moltke who was denied the opportunity to play someone other than the sweet, innocent Vicki Winters) so why shouldn't he?
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Pardon me while I strut a bit. The above family tree was done by yours truly!
[cheerleader] [blob6] [blob5] [blob7] [blob9] [blob3]
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where can we find it?
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Willie Loomis, please see reply #9.
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Sorry this has taken so long, but I finally got to the box with my DS books and checked "Shadows on the Wall," the concept for the show written by Art Wallace. The original names of Elizabeth and Roger's parents were, indeed, Joseph and Carolyn Collins. The Carolyn we know was named for her grandmother.
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Except for the fact that Jamison is their father :)
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yes, like amy was really molly!
[skull_winks]
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LOL! Wasn't Edward originally Oscar?
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http://darkshadows.wikia.com/wiki/The_Collins_Family_Tree
WOW! [8_1_209] That is wonderful! Thanks for the link! That is one site I never knew existed!
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There's a minor error on that page: it lists Chris and Tom Jennings as twins, whereas in fact Chris was about three years older than Tom.
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http://darkshadows.wikia.com/wiki/The_Collins_Family_Tree
Jeremiah had two wives-- Laura and Josette.