Error in DVD 7 Episode ???

[Raholt]

Remember when the DVD set 6 came out and there was mention made of the blatant error made by the actress who played Bathia Mapes, forgettng her line and it being edited out of the DVD release.  Well, I was watching DVD set #7, and I'm not sure but I think I saw another edit.  The scene was Victoria talkng to Elizabeth and there is a knock at the door and Vicki exits the drawing room to answer the door.  In the DVD, you see Vicki leave the room then there is a cut and then you see her open the front door and scream at the sight of Harry Johnson who she thinks is Noah Gifford.  It is too quick.   I have not had a chance to look back at the VHS release of this episode, but I was thinking this was one of those time when there was a technical error show, either the camera showing behind the scenes or something which kept us from seeing Vicki cross the foyer to the door.  In the DVD it jumps from exiting the drawing room to being at the door instantly and it seemed odd to me.  Am I wrong, is it just that way or is something missing here too.

Raholt

[Midnite]

Hi Raholt.

While hanging out at Bette's today, she mentioned that her watching of the DVDs caught up to that scene this morning and thought it seemed odd to her as well.  So she offered to show it to me, and since getting me to watch DS with a good friend requires MUCH arm twisting , we watched the DVD version of that scene followed by the same one on VHS.  And our verdict is that you are exactly right...

To repeat what you said, on the DVD we see Vicki leave Liz behind in the drawing room, and immediately after that she's at the door facing the camera and lets out a scream.  In the video, we see her leave Liz, then there's a brief black screen followed by Vicki approaching the front door, we see her open it (with the camera still behind her) and can see Harry standing there, and then it cuts to the part on the DVD that has Vicki facing the camera and screaming.  So apparently, in editing out the period in which the screen is black, the editor removed some of the action as well.  Good catch!

OT - BTW, since you're one of the original posters from the old SciFi BBs, I thought I'd let you know that I received an email today from another SF poster that I don't think any of us had heard from in ages.  Do you remember Ashenrider/PadreJim?

[Raholt]

Midnite, first off, yes I do remember Ashenrider very well.  He was a great contributor to the old Sci fi B-board and I always enjoyed discussing DS with him.  I hope he is doing well.

Secondly, thanks for checking on that scene for me.  I have just not had the time, with work, to do it, but I knew it didn't look right to me and had all the charactristics of an edit.  Now the question is, why the edit?  When the edit was found in the last set, we were told that it was an error made by the company that is converting the masters to digital format and that there was no intention of trying to clean up the errors in the show.  Okay now an edit has been found not just once now but twice and again it is at a point where an error existed (this time technical) but it also removed part of the scene that was originally there.  Yet we have been repeatedly told the DVD's will be uncut versions of the original episodes.  Now, it is true that these DVD's are being taken from a different set of masters than the VHS tapes were made from.  It could well be that edit exists in the masters they are using for the DVD's, which was the reason given for poor quality in one scene in volume 5 of the DVD's that clearly doesn't show up in the VHS version.  However, at the time that error was found people began questioning MPI about that difference and then the next set it was the editing out of one of the most famous goofs in the show and now this edit.    I will buy that two versions of master tapes may differ somewhat, but two have two scenes edited in two sets of DVD's both times at points where errors of some type existed, makes the explantion of the first one questionable and the claims them not trying to clean up the show and that the DVD's are going to be uncut versions of the series,  even more questionable.  I would like very much to hear what our MPI rep has to say on the subject of this edit.

Raholt 

[Josette]

OT - BTW, since you're one of the original posters from the old SciFi BBs, I thought I'd let you know that I received an email today from another SF poster that I don't think any of us had heard from in ages.  Do you remember Ashenrider/PadreJim?

I've thought several times of posting a list of as many names as I could think of who posted frequently at SciFi but who seem to have disappeared.  I wonder if they're here with different names and thought they might speak up and let us know if I posted their "old" names.  Ashenrider disappeared a long time ago, but every once in a while he'd resurface.  How is he?

[Gothick]

I'm really grateful to everyone who has posted about the cuts in the episodes on DVD.  If I ever do get the DVD's, I will be sure to hang onto my videos as well, since MPI didn't bother paying someone to "correct" those!!!!!

I shudder to think what further cuts await in future volumes...

Oh, I remember Ashenrider very well!  He was charming and talented.  Another one from  the old days I miss is Marcos.  That guy was a real sweetheart.

G.

[Midnite]

How is he?

My apologies to MPI for veering off-topic.  Ashenrider sounded great and is at the same church in NC, and his family is also doing well.  Maybe he can be encouraged to join us when the forums are reopened?

I also heard from Henry/casper_collins this week before he headed off on an 11-day trip to China.  How fun!

[Mysterious Benefactor]

My apologies to MPI for veering off-topic.

I'll get us sort of back on topic. 

For the fun of it I checked to see how that scene plays on Sci-Fi (as we know, Jim Pierson had edited several episodes to remove the glitches) and the only thing that's missing is the black screen glitch - we see Vicki leave the drawing room and then she reappears in the foyer approaching the door. If someone didn't know the glitch had been there, they would never even realize there had been an edit. So, who knows why MPI didn't handle it that way?  :-

[Selby_D._Pearson]

I am hoping the MPI representative will respond to this. We were told that there would be no more edits!

A friend of mine who is collecting the DVDs told me of another edit that I don't think I've read about here. It is pre-1795 when Vicki and Burke are talking in the drawing room with Julia. Julia leaves and while the camera lingers on Burke and Vicki you can hear a distinct off-camera sneeze, most likely Grayson. However, on the new DVDs, this sneeze has been edited out.

I think I'm going to contact Mr. Pierson.

SDP

[Nancy]

I'm really grateful to everyone who has posted about the cuts in the episodes on DVD.  If I ever do get the DVD's, I will be sure to hang onto my videos as well, since MPI didn't bother paying someone to "correct" those!!!!!

Steve, I'm not surprised there were edits made in spite of what was said before a few months ago when all this came up.  It could also be that MPI rep was not given the right information in the first place.

Nancy

[mpi_marketing]

MPI is committed to releasing Dark Shadows in its complete and unedited form as originally broadcast. An outside videotape restoration facility recently digitally remastered the episodes for the program's owner, Dan Curtis Productions, and apparently there are a very few instances where the video facility has made small edits for technical reasons -- since the original masters have various picture blemishes and other problems due to the age of the material and the technology existent at the time of production (1966-71). We are investigating this matter thoroughly to hopefully avoid any further incidents even though the few trims encountered thus far have been minimal.

Thanks,
MPI

[Gothick]

Well, thanks for that note, and good luck with your investigations.

Unfortunately, I can think of entire episodes that would be practically edited out of existence if current industry standards (or, shall we say, rational standards?) are applied to Dark Shadows!

I am afraid that MPI does not realize just how obsessive we Dark Shadows fans are about our favorite show!  Perhaps the discussions here will help you to understand.

G.

[onyx_treasure]

     I was hoping the dvds would be complete and unedited.  I have already purchased 3 sets but now I am re-thinking about whether I will buy anymore.  :-

[Raholt]

With regard to the storyline, the edits are minimal and don't affect the overall story at all.  It is not like edited versions one might see in syndication.  The edits so far have been tiny and all connected, in one form or the other, to flubs be they acting (in only one case so far) or technical.

I do find it regretable that any edits exist at all, due to the dupicating process or what have you.  If someone ordered them done that way to clean them up, even if it was Dan Curtis himself, the intention was misguided.  I can understand that someone might want it to look the best it could look, but that is not what that show was.  It was not a glossy piece of perfection like the 1991 version was suppose to be.  It was live on tape and with live on tape came errors from actors and technical ones as well.  I can see that some might find it embarassing to have an error live forever, but for the fans of DS, we love the show warts and all.  That means we love the errors as much as we love any other part of the show.

Someone may have been thinking they were doing a good thing trying to clean up the show, but what you are doing is taking away part of the charm of the show and part of what made watching it fun and special.

I hope that MPI does investigate these edits and why they occurred and I hope they also share with us any results they get from the investigation.

Raholt

[Craig_Slocum]

I have the MPI Videos, so I am only purchasing the Dark Shadows DVD Collections that Craig Slocum is in. I too noticed there was something different in the scene with Harry Johnson and Victoria Winters, but I was so engrossed in him I forgot about it until I read this topic.  I am keeping the MPI Videos too, like someone else here said. I enjoy the clarity of the DVD's better picture, but I don't think there should be any edits.   

[Miss_Winthrop]

I am afraid that MPI does not realize just how obsessive we Dark Shadows fans are about our favorite show!  Perhaps the discussions here will help you to understand.

Yes we are obsessive. I think that MPI knows this already. I also think that MPI is allowing these edits to happen so that new fans of DS won't see the mistakes.

My advise to MPI...Don't Edit...I along with countless others want every sneeze, wheeze and cough. I want camera mistakes and any out takes, retakes, mistakes and the actors goofing around and whatever else is on the original film. Leave it in. Please!