Did Passing on DS DOOM the WB! Plus could your review 2004 for me?

[Taeylor Collins]

The Wb was doing well with Charmed, Supernatural, Angel (so stupid) for cancelling it and Smallville.  DS would have been a perfect addition.   


NOW we see the WB had to merge with UPN and now they are saying if it doesn't pick up this year.  Then it's gone too.   I personally MISS THE WB so much.  It was better than UPN.   However, it was after they treated Angel like they did.  Treated DS like they did.  And wouldn't let Charmed know if they were coming back for another season.  They really pissed me off and I quit watching anything but Charmed.  THE MOUNTAIN.  GOD remember that trash.  I am sorry I cannot beleive you can spend 6 million dollars on any pilot and not save it somehow.  Whether reshoots or cast changes.   

So to who have seen in at the Fest!

What was Marley Shelton like as Victoria.  I loved her in GRINDHOUSE!
Alec Newman he was on Angel a couple times and liked him!
Kelly Hu loved her in XMEN!!
and the rest of the new actors and characters!!  Thanks so much!

[Mysterious Benefactor]

There's a whole topic about the '04 pilot on the Current Talk '05 II board that was started after many of us were lucky enough to see the pilot at the '05 LA Fest. Simply do a search for it (the search feature is most definitely our friend ) or check through the topics on the board. It's called something like "The 2004 WB Pilot". 

[Taeylor Collins]

I will do.  I am learning. If you need to delte that post to save space by all means do Midnite! Thanks for being so nice and helpful.  And from what I understand you run boards correct?  Thanks for it all!!!

[Mysterious Benefactor]

Oh, there's no need to delete this topic. In fact, you raise a question re dooming the WB that would definitely be interesting to discuss. 

[GooberCollins]

The WB has a history of crappy moves. First one that springs to mind is canceling Buffy in its prime. Thank God UPN picked it back up. They also really started trying to steal Whedon's thunder on everything, in several major steps. First was announcing that [spoiler]James Marsters would be appearing on Angel, making Spike's death obviously not permanent[/spoiler] before the series finale of Buffy. Second came bossing Whedon into making Season 5 more episodic to attract new viewers, despite having a decent-sized fanbase (which The CW recently did by canceling Reba, its highest-rated sitcom, just for not attracting the audience they wanted). Finally, they canceled it, totally unfairly.


Charmed, on the other hand, I think was ready for a rest. Our three seasons with Prue and our first two with Paige were thoroughly enjoyable, but in my mind, the show went on a downward spiral after Season 5. Just my opinion, though.

Never watched Supernatural, and Smallville never really managed to hold my interest.

I can't state my opinion on the 2004 pilot, as I had no interest and barely any knowledge of the show in 2005.

I think The WB was probably doomed from the start. They were going after the teen audience and when they got great shows like Buffy, when people other than teenagers started watching them, that just didn't fit with their image. They wanted to be the trendy teen network, save their old stand-by 7th Heaven. They were an underachiever network that didn't know what to do with its newfound success, so it simply flushed it down the toilet.

[Doug]

It seems like the WB had poor management that made poor decisions.

[Taeylor Collins]

Charmed, on the other hand, I think was ready for a rest. Our three seasons with Prue and our first two with Paige were thoroughly enjoyable, but in my mind, the show went on a downward spiral after Season 5. Just my opinion, though.

Its all good.  I just like Paige a lot more than Prue so I enjoyed more years with Paige.  However, It could have ended in Season Seven (if ended properly) and I would have been fine. 

I also had forgotten how Buffy was treated like crap too before it was saved by UPN!! I like the UPN years though.  They gave them ALOT more freedom.  However, Season Five is my favorite!

[GooberCollins]

I like both Paige and Prue about equally; I just think that the writing got a little sloppy around Season 6.

I consider every season of Buffy except 1 and 4 to be my favorite season.

I can bitch about most every network until the cows come home, but The WB gets the most of it.

[JWGucciEnvy]

Actually UPN was always in the gutter of ratings since inception. The WB had some high points during the late 90's till early 2000's. But both were never overall rating champs. Usually WB was the 5th network and UPN was the 6th network. WB had success with the teen audience while UPN had more success with African-American & Straight Male Community. Certain shows by the time 2006 rolled around were already starting to lose ratings and key demos. It didn't make sense to keep all of WB shows and UPN shows on the air.  But someone thought let's combine the two networks and make a stronger network. 

The problem with horror/sci-fi shows is that sometimes they have a huge following, but the mainstream/casual viewer are not loyal to TV Shows. Hence, Charmed, Angel, Buffy and other shows have huge loyal fan base but all were losing ratings in key demos, and probably were costing too much money to produce in the later seasons.


WB and UPN premiere on the same day and ended to become one channel due to financial reasons and actually just a plain smart business move.

The cancel of supernatural shows really had nothing to do with WB downfall., because overall the WB's goal was to attractive teen to young adult audience. That is why One Tree Hill and Smallville continue on CW because they were still performing well in demos.

[MagnusTrask]

Maybe networks go through phases, where certain self-destructive ideas become fashionable.  A lot of good programs were ruined in the 70s by a trend of network executives thinking that if a show is doing really well, change it immediately so that it doesn't get stale.   (Rhoda's divorce comes to mind.)  They also kept trying to turn every other drama show into The Fugitive!

WB had its highest ratings with Gilmore Girls (a very good show, and I hate everything), but the creator/producers just wanted a guarantee of two more years, so that they didn't have to look after every little detail on GG and also write most of it, AND keep worrying about keeping it on the air, and negotiating about it.   WB just refused, and I have a feeling they were going nuts trying to keep a dozen plates spinning in the air, and felt they had to quit.   So the seventh year was horrible, and it was cancelled.

Now Jay Leno is being pushed out of the way so Conan can have the Tonight Show, and Jimmy Fallon (?) gets Conan's show.    I didn't like Leno's show but it's a crazy way to treat the creative people whom they all feed off of.   I'd thought Leno was quitting, but no, he doesn't want to go.

[Taeylor Collins]

Nevetheless, I think WB made some stupid decesions through the years and I for one liked THE WB  better than THE CW.  I wished they had never combined!  Just my opinion.  Charmed really didn't start losing viewers until Season Seven and they gave it an 8th season so apparently it was making them money.

I think the CW needs to try so more Supernatural routes.  That is really what defined The WB. The have plenty of teen shows that is for sure.    Not that I am baggin them I am of course watching 90210 and I have followed Smallville since it's inception!

To me this shows one how silly they are. They are gonna do a show called THE GRAYSONS based on Robin before he met Batman.  I mean how exciting is that gonna be.  He was an acrobat.  WOW! Sounds fun!  ::EYE ROLL::  Now if they did NIGHT WING I would probably be on board!

[JWGucciEnvy]

WB tried to do Birds of Prey but it didn't catch on. Didn't they also do an Aquaman pilot. ??

Buffy The Vampire Slayer was just as much as teen show as a supernatural show. You have to remember at the height of WB, Dawson's Creek, Felicity, and slew of other non supernatural shows were on the air, such as Popular....Actually 7th Heaven was the WB highest rated show ever.

In the later years Gilmore Girls, Everwood, One Tree Hill and Reba were actually doing better than the supernatural shows.  Sad but true.

[GooberCollins]

I don't necessarily think that supernatural programming is the way to go. Yes, the WB had more of it than most of the other networks, but it was more their teen-young adult demographic that defined them. Aside from that, it was a place where smartly written television could exist without too much trouble. Granted, there have been some road blocks (canceling both Buffy and Angel in their prime, and leaving Charmed on for two or three seasons longer than they should have), but it worked. One can't help but wonder how some of the "tragically canceled" shows would have done there, Wonderfalls and Firefly in particular, though Firefly is a bit out of the WB's normal demographic. I've never been able to get into 7th Heaven, and Gilmore Girls and Smallville look like they're pretty good from what I've seen of them.

Speaking of Reba, they canceled it despite the cast and crew wanting to go for a few more seasons, as well as the fact that it was their highest-rated sitcom. No, it wasn't the best show ever or anything, but why they would cancel it under those circumstances is beyond me.

[JWGucciEnvy]

I have read that CW has admitted that they never should have let go of REBA, the reruns have done very well for CW. It was a dumb move.

I agree. WB could not fight with the BIG 3 Networks, so their concern was the KEY demos and that was the young audience. Sort of like Fox in early 1990's.

[Taeylor Collins]

Goober, I don't think The CW should solely focus on supernatural, but since the actual show SUPERNATURAL is leaving the air in their next season it would be something to look into.  Especially if Smallville doesn't go beyond it's 8Th season!  It has worked for them so they should always look down that road.  But The Graysons? 

I never liked 7Th Heaven, I never got into Gilmore Girls but it was a good show and well written with SNAPPY dialogue!  I am so glad one of the main writers is coming on board of 90210! 

I think Charmed maybe should have quite at the end of Seasons Seven but it wasn't the producers fault because the WB didn't let them know if they were picked up so they had to write a series/season finale to close out season seven.  I am happy it was renewed even though Season 8 wasn't the best season it had some gems in it and because they deserved to end the show properly and not with them abandoning their destiny! That would have been a slap in the face to me.  I would have been very an unhappy viewer! Thankfully I was completely and utterly thrilled (as a fan) with the penultimate and the series finale.  Prue could have made it a bit better but we all KNOW that wasn't happening!

Smallville is a really good show.  I became disillusioned for a while, but now they are moving closer to Clark's destiny and he is now working at the Daily Planet and working with Lois.  It almost seems like a new show and I think if Tom Welling would do more seasons it could possibly go for a 9Th and 10Th season, especially with the focus now being on Metropolis as it has now become.  Supernatural is also a great show.  I lost track of it during the first season so I am catching up on DVD.  I just think it's one of the best shows on TV right now.

I loved Reba and that show was just one more reason for me to be BEYOND pissed at The WB!  They were STUPID for cancelling it. It takes something good to make me laugh because I don't think comedies are very funny these days.  They're are only a handful!