DARK SHADOWS FORUMS
General Discussions => Current Talk Archive => Current Talk '24 I => Current Talk '02 II => Topic started by: Josette on November 06, 2002, 11:02:14 AM
-
I just love this part! That smile on Judith's face as she reads the will and then reveals all to her brothers is priceless. She's so much fun. And I absolutely L-O-O-O-V-E that scene when she wakes Edward up in the middle of the night just to announce that she's decided to move to the grandmother's room. Delicious! I hadn't realized that it occurred immediately after the initial "gaining of power" and I was looking forward to it happening soon.
-
...And I absolutely L-O-O-O-V-E that scene when she wakes Edward up in the middle of the night just to announce that she's decided to move to the grandmother's room. Delicious!
Yes Yes Yes!!! OMG - Was that priceless??
Ya know, from the moment Carl came skipping down the stairs, LOL, right through the very end of the whole drawing room scene with Judith and her "poor" brothers, was priceless. So rich. 1897 at its best IMHO!
-CLC :)
(Developing a fondness for Judith)
-
She gets better!
jennifer
always wanted to be a princess myself!
-
Judith fascinates me and I think Joan Bennett did some of her best work on DS in this particular story arc.
You know, several years ago there was an interesting thread on the Dominion about women and DS, that is, about whether the female characters were primarily weak or strong. I forget who pointed it out (wasn't me) but really with the exception of Joshua, most of the control of the family comes from the female characters.
Luciaphil
-
I forget who pointed it out (wasn't me) but really with the exception of Joshua, most of the control of the family comes from the female characters.
Well, that is a good point. But, it seems that it is also only the older females who can have any character, intelligence and strength. I've never understood the male desire to mate with a pretty idiot. From a species perspective, I can understand the young part, and we all know that beauty is a powerful attractant, even animals respond to it. But why would you want dumb children? I can't comprehend why men who are not dumber than a box of rocks don't care if a woman is.
-
Well, that is a good point. But, it seems that it is also only the older females who can have any character, intelligence and strength. I've never understood the male desire to mate with a pretty idiot. From a species perspective, I can understand the young part, and we all know that beauty is a powerful attractant, even animals respond to it. But why would you want dumb children? I can't comprehend why men who are not dumber than a box of rocks don't care if a woman is.
They are probably assuming that their progeny will inherit their brains, lol. (Although for someone like Barnabas, that probably is a very dangerous assumption).
If you look at Carolyn, you can sort of see that she might one day be able to stand on her own. Maggie and Vicki? Forget it.
Luciaphil
-
Josette Wrote:
I just love this part! That smile on Judith's face as she reads the will and then reveals all to her brothers is priceless. She's so much fun.
This was a great scene and Judith is just eating it up!
And it's great to see her in such a strong role, a far cry from poor Naomi! How times have changed!
I was wondering though just why Grandmama decided not to leave anything to Edward? I mean if she found
him important enough to feel that HE should be the only one who gets to know the secret, why would she decide to leave him nothing? If she felt Judith was capable enough of handling the whole estate & monies by herself than she should of told her the secret then. Evidently she didn't trust Edward as well as the other two brothers.
-
Cassandra, I am almost certain that your questions about the will are answered in upcoming episodes. I hesitate to use spoilers because I am never sure if I am remembering correctly or if I am enhancing my memories with solutions that never happened.
Here's a hint though; If you recall, there was a point when Barnabas catches Sandor forging the will and Sandor states that he is not very good at it and Barn says something like, "Oh your very good, you just need a little help" (I know I butchered that quote.)
What puzzles me a great deal is the fact that Quentin isn't having a fit, because he knows that the will should have been rewritten to his favor. He's got to know something went terribly wrong with Evan's and his plans to change the will. I can't believe he didn't rush over to Evan's or the Old House after the reading of the will. I don't remember but I think this is also resolved in upcoming episodes.
dom
-
Talking of strong younger women--I think Carolyn did a wonderful job running the house in 1968 when Liz was confined to Wyndcliffe. Those scenes with Harry, in particular, are just priceless. Contrast how Carolyn dealt with Harry, with how intimidated she was by shifty, sexy original Willie Loomis in 1967, and it shows just how much she had grown up (of course, she DID pull a pistol on Willie, which showed just what grit that gal had).
Alexis Stokes (I mean the real Alexis) also seems to be a young woman with a decent head on her shoulders.
Gothick
-
I just love this part! That smile on Judith's face as she reads the will and then reveals all to her brothers is priceless.
Loved that scene, too, Josette.
However, I am bothered by something. Apart from the preamble, we never actually hear Judith read the will to her brothers, do we? It seems the DS writers really missed on on a possibly even more dramatic scene here. Can't you just imagine the expressions on their faces the moment they learn that sister Judith was left everything? Priceless!
I have seen the 1897 storyline once before, but don't remember everything. Does anyone here have any idea why the writer's left the reading of the will out? Does it have something to do with a developing storyline? Or did I suffer a blackout (say it ain't so!) Honestly, I felt a bit cheated! :-(
-
What puzzles me a great deal is the fact that Quentin isn't having a fit, because he knows that the will should have been rewritten to his favor. He's got to know something went terribly wrong with Evan's and his plans to change the will. I can't believe he didn't rush over to Evan's or the Old House after the reading of the will. I don't remember but I think this is also resolved in upcoming episodes.
I think he was having "grave" misgivings about his "undertaking" since Grandmamama began making pesky trouble for him!
-
I think he was having "grave" misgivings about his "undertaking" since Grandmamama began making pesky trouble for him!
You suppose the will that Judith found in the family album is the original? That would make sense considering Quentin's reaction. I guess he thinks Granny put the will in the book herself.
dom
-
I like Judith. For the first time in a while we have a strong female character who isn't a villain. I loved that scene in the episodes where she took everyone into the parlor. Also loved the scene where she awakens Edward in the middle of the night.
Vicki and Maggie started out as pretty sensible people when they came. Like when Vicki went behind Lizzie's back to find out some info. Unlike Rachel, what Vicki was looking for concerned her, which is what made Rachel a lot more annoying then Vicki when she was searching for an answer to what was in the tower room. Maggie had some spunk to, but Barnabas drained it out of her.
Carolyn seemed to be strong until at least 1969. Haven't seen the Levithan or summer of 1970 storylines yet though.
-
Edith is definitely Joan Bennett's best role on the show - though Naomi comes in a close second, IMHO. While she never becomes a villainess per se, she definitely does get to dish her share of dirt - though when it comes, have to say it's highly deserved.
During the character's absence from this storyline, I really miss her. Edith's pretty damned fascinating - she had a ton of backbone, and was crazybright! You could always see those inner wheels turning 'round.
-
You suppose the will that Judith found in the family album is the original? That would make sense considering Quentin's reaction. I guess he thinks Granny put the will in the book herself.
Yes, that was my understanding. Sandor was trying to forge a copy when Barney caught him. So, presumably Barney had the original. Then he had Magda predict where it could be found.
-
Yes, that was my understanding. Sandor was trying to forge a copy when Barney caught him. So, presumably Barney had the original. Then he had Magda predict where it could be found.
Thanks for clearing that up, kuanyin.:) Now I feel horrible (not to mention stupid ;D) for misleading Cassandra in a post above, (sorry Cassandra! :'(). I thought Barn had Sandor forge the will to favor Judith. I have to say that I am shocked that granny would cut off the boys completely. I guess Judith's sense of duty convinced the old lady that she would best serve the interests of the family and Collinwood.
dom (who calls his disease - memory enhancementitis)
-
dom wrote:
Thanks for clearing that up, kuanyin. Now I feel horrible (not to mention stupid ) for misleading Cassandra in a post above, (sorry Cassandra! ). I thought Barn had Sandor forge the will to favor Judith. I have to say that I am shocked that granny would cut off the boys completely
Hey, don't worry about it dom. Alot that goes on still doesn't make much sense to either. I wish that we got to see the part where Judith read the Will to everyone. I would have loved to see the reason she gave everything to Judith and left nothing to Edward.(not to mention the look on everyone's faces)[wow]
Quentin, we already knew about and it had been mentioned that he wasn't getting any money. And Carl, with his crazy self I figured wasn't getting anything either. But Edward? Now this is hard to figure out. Here was the Grandson she felt was wise enough to be told the terrible family secret and yet she doesn't consider him wise enough to get at least a share of her money? [hdscrt]
-
Quentin, we already knew about and it had been mentioned that he wasn't getting any money. And Carl, with his crazy self I figured wasn't getting anything either. But Edward? Now this is hard to figure out. Here was the Grandson she felt was wise enough to be told the terrible family secret and yet she doesn't consider him wise enough to get at least a share of her money? [hdscrt]
My best guess: she didn't like him. He is a pompous ass and a half. Regardless of your interpretation of Edith, this is a woman who apparently ran the house, the business, and the family for at least forty odd years, maybe longer. Edward acts like he's bought into the "women are the weaker sex" Victorian theory hook, line and sinker. Maybe he butted in once too often. Maybe he just irritated the hell out of her. Maybe she wasn't obligated to leave him anything.
Just speculating . . .
Luciaphil
-
Maggie had some spunk to, but Barnabas drained it out of her.
Barnabas seems to have that affect on women ... i really liked the provocative, self-centered, flirtatious early Julia Hoffman. . miss her . . . she's too concerned now with everyone else. . she needs to be concerned with her own needs, especially the libidinous ones. . .
-
[spoiler]Well Judith said she had been the only one who spent most of her time caring for Edith, so maybe that tipped the scale in her favor. Probably Carl had been to busy playing pratical jokes on everyone, Quentin was too busy chasing skirts around the world, and Edward was too busy being.....well, Edward. As been said, the guy WAS a pompous ass, and that may have been a big turnoff for Edith. As for her wanting to tell him the secret despite the fact she was cutting him off, well maybe in that instance she thought that was one thing she felt only a male Collins was up to the task.[/spoiler]
Totally agree the reading of Edith's will was a blast, and one of the best DS episodes!
-
I absolutely love JB's portrayal of Judith Collins. I loved her and JB was a character actress as well as the most of the of the cast. Flora, Judith, and Liz all had their own different flavor! BRAVO Miss Bennett to you I BOW!!! YAY This is my 300th post!!
-
As for why Edith wanted to tell Edward, not Judith, the Secret...
It may be that Edith had no choice in the matter of who should be told the Secret. I don't know why that might be, but I'm sure that something could be dreamed up.
Alternatively, she may have felt that on the off-chance that the Secret would have to be dealt with physically, Edward would be more up to the task than Judith.
Or else she really wanted to stick it to Edward. "So, sonny boy, you think the Collins family is the best thing since sliced bread? Well, let me tell you what it's really like!" But then Edward arrived too late for her to have her fun, poor thing.
-
As for why Edith wanted to tell Edward, not Judith, the Secret...
It may be that Edith had no choice in the matter of who should be told the Secret. I don't know why that might be, but I'm sure that something could be dreamed up.
Dialogue would seem to back up her not having a choice. In the ep that introduces 1897, Edith tells Quentin that he can't be told the secret because he's not the oldest; Edward is. And after [spoiler]Edith dies without revealing it to him,[/spoiler] Edward explains to Barnabas that the secret has always been told to the oldest son.