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General Discussions => Current Talk Archive => Current Talk '24 I => Current Talk '02 II => Topic started by: ShadowsAtlanta on August 03, 2002, 02:01:51 AM

Title: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ShadowsAtlanta on August 03, 2002, 02:01:51 AM: I would like to expand upon a post I entered under a separate topic by posing the following question:

What do you consider the two most disturbing events during the entire run of Dark Shadows?

The moments may bother you because they contained actions you found objectionable or out of character for one or more of the players, or perhaps they irk you because they seem to not flow with the overall story.

Here are my picks, which contains spoilers for the early Barnabas and Leviathan storylines:

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1) Barnabas murdering Dr. Woodard (and forcing Julia to help him) during the early Barnabas storyline. This was totally cold-blooded and horrific, and it is made worse by the fact the Barn forced Julia to actually inject Woodard with the letal poison. It just doesn't get much worse in my book.

2) The totally unnecessary and ludicrous revelation during the Leviathan storyline that Vickie Winters had been killed in 1796. Jeb Hawkes wasn't even in human form before the succession of little brats grew up to be him, so how the heck was he around in that form back in the 1700's?? Plus, Vickie hadn't even been on the show in years! Why throw in such a gratuitious and illogical death for a character that had been such a cornerstone of the show's earlier storylines? Personally, I like to pretend this episode never really happened, along with the rest of the Leviathan storyline.

Okay, stepping off my soapbox... which DS moments distress you folks? :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: WileyS on August 03, 2002, 02:13:05 AM: I think I agree with Woodard's murder as being one of the most disturbing DS moments.

I have not been watching DS on the Sci Fi so don't know if this has happened yet, but another plot point really bothered me. It's in this Adam storyline but just in case I will put spoiler alerts.
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I was really disturbed when Angelique/Cassandra blinded Sam Evans.......that part really bothered me. I guess it's because I'm extremely nearsighted myself. I have to fastforward through those scenes when I watch because I hate seeing Sam and Maggie's reactions.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Nicole on August 03, 2002, 02:15:24 AM: Here we go

**Spoilers**

1) John Yaeger and Buffie Harrington in 1970PT. Man creeped me out in the first place, but his thinly vieled rape of Ms Harrington sealed the deal.

2) Edith's death in 1840 baffled me to no end. With just one little plot point, the writers obliterated an entire storyline (1897). Would it have killed them to check back to see what they had done earlier? Very bothersome.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: WileyS on August 03, 2002, 02:26:47 AM: 1840/1970 PT spoilers
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I'm in the minority but the Edith thing never bothered me.....I've always just assumed that the first time around nothing happened to Edith and she lived until 1897....and the events were altered when Barnabas/Julia went back to 1840. The series didn't spend very much time in the regular storyline after 1840 flashback ended so we never got to see how Edith's death in 1840 affected everything else. The reason the Collins family continued was because Edith and Gabriel already had children..... This is just how I see it so I can pretend the writers didn't make another error. :)

re: 1970 PT. I thought Elizabeth Eis' Buffie was the most interesting character of this storyline.....that implied rape scene was very powerful. Wish Eis would have had a longer stints on the show.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: lurkerintheshadows on August 03, 2002, 02:33:14 AM: 1)Barnabas making Julia kill Dr. Woodard >:(
2)Implied rape of Carolyn by Adam :'(
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Maria_Merriweather on August 03, 2002, 02:44:48 AM: 1. I agree the most disturbing moment is the death of Dr. Woodard at the hands of Julia (coerced by Barnabas)

2. Many of the early scenes between David and Roger. David is so obviously troubled and Roger is so lacking in parenting skills.

3. The shooting of Willie by the sheriff and several of his deputies. Violence was common on TV then but this still doesn't fit--very unnecessary and contrived.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ProfStokes on August 03, 2002, 03:00:24 AM: Very interesting discussion, ShadowsAtlanta!

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2) The totally unnecessary and ludicrous revelation during the Leviathan storyline that Vickie Winters had been killed in 1796. Jeb Hawkes wasn't even in human form before the succession of little brats grew up to be him, so how the heck was he around in that form back in the 1700's?? Plus, Vickie hadn't even been on the show in years! Why throw in such a gratuitious and illogical death for a character that had been such a cornerstone of the show's earlier storylines? Personally, I like to pretend this episode never really happened, along with the rest of the Leviathan storyline.

I'm with you completely on this one! The claim that Jeb had killed Vicki made no sense to me whatsoever. If anything it confused an already complicated plot. What was Jeb's motive supposed to be anyway?

There are several other points in the show that troubled me: Naomi's suicide, Sam's blindness, Joe's madness. However, I think Disturbing Moment #2 is a tie between Ben Stokes's death and Barnabas's declaration of love for Angelique, both of the 1840 storyline.

Ben Stokes was one of the most memorable and admirable characters not only of 1795 but the entire DS run. His loyalty to Barnabas and desire to be helpful was deeply touching. So it was enlightening to learn in 1968 that Ben went on to live a good, full life and die peacefully of natural causes; however, on traveling back to 1840, history changes and old Ben dies violently, a victim of the supernatural. The killing of this great character, and in such a gruesome way (Judah Zachary's spirit causes Ben to behead himself) disgusted me. I think it was callous and tacky of the writers. >:(

After all of the misery that Angelique caused Barnabas, and all of the lives her spells and machinations took either directly or indirectly, I just cannot believe that Barnabas would be able to forgive her, let alone decide he loves her. (sorry, VAM, Lindsey, and other Angelique fans). Even the cure itself seems ridiculous. Suddenly she has the power to simply reverse the curse when, in every other timeline, she'd tried to do the same and failed? IMHO, none of it rang true.

Near the end of MST3K's "Hobgoblins" episode, (a truly wretched movie, BTW) the robots conduct a mock interview with the film's writer/director/producer. Crow T. Robot turns to 'Rick Sloan' and asks, "Were you on drugs when you wrote this script? Did somebody open your skull and replace your brain with rat droppings?" It doesn't happen very often, but there are times when I wonder the same thing about the DS writers. The above occasions ::) represent those times.

ProfStokes
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: VictoriaWintersRox on August 03, 2002, 03:01:41 AM: Spoilers.....

1. The murder of Dr. Woodard. I don't see why Barnabas had Julia come down there..Dave was one of her friends, and even if she knew he had to die, she didn't have to witness it.

For #2..It's sorta tie for me. I don't like what Cassandra/Angelique did to poor Sam Evans. She did entirely to much to him. I don't like how they killed off Ben Stokes, like ProfStokes said.

I don't know of another one that I would say was 'very disturbing' but I don't like how they killed Vicki off in the Levithan storyline because she hasn't been on the show for a year by then. I think it was just a way for them to get Roger Davis in an episode as the ghost of Peter Bradford, so I think it was done in desperation and usually ignore that fact.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: matthew789 on August 03, 2002, 03:41:34 AM: SPOILERS...

The most disturbing moment for me was Barnabas' brief return to 1795 to save Vickie. The original 1795 storyline was terrific and this short flasback changed everything. Joshua was in Boston, Ben strangled Natalie DuPres and Barnabas let Nathan off the hook, then killed him anyway.
Alexandra Molke was pregnant at the time and the writers try to quikly get rid of her. Certainly they could have had her and Jeff (Peter) move to California or something. The writers must have been smoking pot in 1968.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: tripwire on August 03, 2002, 04:21:57 AM: SPOILERS...

i didnt particularly like the whole leviathan stuff anyway, and then to bring peter bradford back as a ghost, to haunt jeb, declaring he caused vicki winters death was totally absurd, cant believe they went that direction...And for Barnabas to even consider killing David because he may or may not know his "secret" i thought was out of context too...such devotion to the collins family..yeah, right....and then for him to go back to 1897, because david and chris jennings were in great danger, well, jennings was practically a stranger...i know that barnabas did most of the evil things as a vampire..(killing of woodard, carl collins) but yet, in 1897, as a vampire, he does what he can for the 2, then kills carl....maybe when vicki mutters "i dont understand" she was really talking about the scripts she was being handed.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Maggie Evans on August 03, 2002, 04:41:42 AM: I think the most disturbing for me was when Angelique killed little sarah :'(
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Linda on August 03, 2002, 04:44:42 AM: Quote
Here we go

**Spoilers**

1) John Yaeger and Buffy Harrington in 1970PT. Man creeped me out in the first place, but his thinly vieled rape of Ms Harrington sealed the deal.

I agree, that was the most disturbing to me, too, because the sexual brutality was really overt. However, there were a couple of scenes between Barnabas and Maggie in the early Barnabas episodes, during the kidnapping sequence, that also implied some serious violence.

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2) Edith's death in 1840 baffled me to no end. With just one little plot point, the writers obliterated an entire storyline (1897). Would it have killed them to check back to see what they had done earlier? Very bothersome.

She seemed to have some leanings toward the dark side -- it's entirely possible that she was actually a part of a coven, and was resurrected somehow.

If you want to read a great story about Edith, check out Luciaphil's "The Education of Judith Collins." What she has completed is posted to ShadowsAfterDark on YahooGroups.

http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/shadowsafterdark

Note: The group IS age-restricted, so you have to sign on and click the link accepting the disclaimer before you can subscribe.

The story is superbly written and in addition to creating a really plausible background that explains why Judith was the way she was, it offers some implied solutions to the Edith paradox. :) :)

Cheers,

Linda
Title: >:(Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Nicole on August 03, 2002, 05:48:38 AM: Goodness, you've all thought of a few things I hadn't thought of initially.

Ben's death was needlessly gruesome and Carl's was just unwarrented.

Admittedly, I've yet to see Dr. Woodward's death (no one changed my tape out at home >:( ) but I can imagine that it was bad, seeing as it proves to be Juia's point of no return.

Barn forgiving Angelique: a crowd pleaser for some but baffling nonetheless.

PS: I'll have to check out Luciaphil's story. I've been reading everything in sight over the last few days (so as not to write myself) so I'll get to it quickly.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: MsCriseyde on August 03, 2002, 06:18:59 AM: Two words: Amanda Harris. ;)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 03, 2002, 06:27:05 AM: Quote
Two words: Amanda Harris. ;)

ROFLMAO!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Mark Rainey on August 03, 2002, 06:33:40 AM: Quote
Two words: Amanda Harris.

And let's not forget Keith Prentice's pants.

[shadow=black,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: scout75 on August 03, 2002, 06:34:29 AM: Dr. Woodard's murder has little emotional resonance for me--probably because the death scenes were played out by Peter Turgeon instead of Robert Gerringer: the second and best Dr. Woodard.
Title: ;DRe: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Nicole on August 03, 2002, 06:56:05 AM: Quote
Two words: Amanda Harris. ;)

I guess I stand corrected ;D
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: MsCriseyde on August 03, 2002, 07:07:36 AM: Upon closer examination, I realized that this thread actually calls for the two most disturbing DS moments. So let me add to my original remarks:

(1) Amanda Harris
(2) Olivia Corey

And Sheenasma will back me up on this. ;D
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Craig_Slocum on August 03, 2002, 07:18:56 AM: The first most disturbing event on Dark Shadows was when Vicki killed Noah Gifford, >:( the second one was the under developed character of Harry Johnson and his no explanation departure. ?!?
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Midnite on August 03, 2002, 07:24:22 AM: Quote
Upon closer examination, I realized that this thread actually calls for the two most disturbing DS moments. So let me add to my original remarks:

(1) Amanda Harris
(2) Olivia Corey

ROFL!!!

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If you want to read a great story about Edith, check out Luciaphil's "The Education of Judith Collins." What she has completed is posted to ShadowsAfterDark on YahooGroups.

http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/shadowsafterdark

Note: The group IS age-restricted, so you have to sign on and click the link accepting the disclaimer before you can subscribe.

The story is superbly written and in addition to creating a really plausible background that explains why Judith was the way she was, it offers some implied solutions to the Edith paradox. :) :)

Luciaphil's ongoing story is an all-time favorite of mine-- really excellent! In addition to the SAD e-group, it's also available online on one of the SciFi DS boards (Creative, #25):

Chaps 1 thru 8 can be found at
http://bboard.scifi.com/bboard/browse.cgi/1/1/1645?lnum=40

and Chaps 9 thru 12 are at
http://bboard.scifi.com/bboard/browse.cgi/1/1/1645?lnum=79
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Mark Rainey on August 03, 2002, 07:35:16 AM: Quote
Upon closer examination, I realized that this thread actually calls for the two most disturbing DS moments.

As you can see, I listed a pair:

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And let's not forget Keith Prentice's pants.

[shadow=purple,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Linda on August 03, 2002, 08:05:26 AM: Quote
Two words: Amanda Harris. ;)

LOL!! Or maybe Leona Eltridge? :D :D :D

Cheers,

Linda
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Linda on August 03, 2002, 08:12:49 AM: Quote
Dr. Woodard's murder has little emotional resonance for me--probably because the death scenes were played out by Peter Turgeon instead of Robert Gerringer: the second and best Dr. Woodard.

Oh, man -- you are so right about Robert Gerringer being the BEST Dr. Woodard. You know, I hadn't seen that scene in quite awhile, and for some reason I kept thinking that it WAS Robert Gerringer's Dr. Woodard who got killed....so I watched the tape with the Peter Turgeon episodes, and I thought he was so obnoxious that instead of being particularly put off by Julia's turn toward the dark side, I found myself yelling, "Yes! Kill him! Kill him!!!!"

Cheers,

Linda
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Linda on August 03, 2002, 08:14:56 AM: Quote
And let's not forget Keith Prentice's pants.

[shadow=black,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]

Front or back? :D :D

Cheers,

Linda
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Julia99 on August 03, 2002, 09:04:41 AM: These are all truly horrific moments but the one I find most disturbing perhaps even more than the murder of Dr. Woodard is Barnabas's idiotic confession to Julia in 1840 that Angelique was his only true love.. .egads!

Okay. .think it, feel it but don't tell THIS PARTICULAR woman another stupid tale of your lost loves. . .she's just about HAD it with you . ..I know when Julia went back to 1971 she finally left his *ss. . . or went on some huge hedonistic romp in Europe.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 03, 2002, 09:30:49 AM: Quote
And let's not forget Keith Prentice's pants.

[shadow=black,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]

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Front or back?

Cheers,

Linda

I vote for Front. Either Morgan used a different tailor than his brothers, or, well...

-CLC ;)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Nicole on August 03, 2002, 09:37:04 AM: Quote
And let's not forget Keith Prentice's pants.

[shadow=black,left,300]--Mark[/shadow]

**bad taste alert**

Hey, watch it...you'll poke an eye out with just a mention of that

(forgive me, couldn't resist)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 03, 2002, 10:27:39 AM: Quote
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2) The totally unnecessary and ludicrous revelation during the Leviathan storyline that Vickie Winters had been killed in 1796. Jeb Hawkes wasn't even in human form before the succession of little brats grew up to be him, so how the heck was he around in that form back in the 1700's?? Plus, Vickie hadn't even been on the show in years! Why throw in such a gratuitious and illogical death for a character that had been such a cornerstone of the show's earlier storylines? Personally, I like to pretend this episode never really happened, along with the rest of the Leviathan storyline.

SPOILERS................SPOILERS.................SPOILERS......

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Im with you on that one! This made absolutely no sense at all to me. It was nice to know that Vicky was at least happy when she left with Jeff, so why drudge up something that totally makes no sense at all? If they wanted to bring Peter Bradford back on the show that much, why not just have him come back as another character?

Also didn't like how Ben Stokes was killed off when they went back to the past again. As Prof.Stokes had mentioned in her post, it was great to hear that Ben was finally rewarded for his loyalty to the Collins family and had lived a long & peaceful life. Then to go back in the past and see him die so horribly just put a damper on everything. It's like the writers didn't want to see anyone having a happy ending on the show.

Another big disappointment was when Eve suddenly decides that she's in love with Jeff Clark/Peter Bradford. To have such a strong woman throwing herself all over him just didn't make much sense to me. Of all the guys on the show, they had to pick him? These two were so mismatched it wasn't funny.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: VAM on August 03, 2002, 01:44:12 PM: BATHIA MAPES
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: sheenasma on August 03, 2002, 02:51:05 PM: Quote
Upon closer examination, I realized that this thread actually calls for the two most disturbing DS moments. So let me add to my original remarks:

(1) Amanda Harris
(2) Olivia Corey

And Sheenasma will back me up on this.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I started reading this thread, and had the exact same thing to say....just a dollar short here, agin!
Nancy
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Blue_Whale_Barfly on August 03, 2002, 03:11:47 PM: Quote
BATHIA MAPES

For that Vam you must go to the house of the curse! ;D
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: MikeS on August 03, 2002, 04:05:55 PM: Quote
Dr. Woodard's murder has little emotional resonance for me--probably because the death scenes were played out by Peter Turgeon instead of Robert Gerringer: the second and best Dr. Woodard.

I agree scout75, the impact of Woodard's death was lessened somewhat by the recast. Turgeon just couldn't capture the essence of Gerringer's Woodard. It was almost like watching a different character.
And yet...I still consider Woodard's murder the most disturbing event on DS. The pure evil of Barnabas' actions, coupled with Julia's betrayal of her good friend (and though she was coerced by Barnabas, it was, ultimately, her choice) was deeply disturbing. And, when I think of the event, I still think of Gerringer's kindly doctor as the one who was murdered. Had Gerringer actually played out those scenes, I'm sure the emotional impact would have been even more powerful.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: VAM on August 03, 2002, 04:11:01 PM: Quote

For that Vam you must go to the house of the curse! ;D

ETERNAL PUNISHMENT [angryf]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: jennifer on August 03, 2002, 04:48:53 PM: S
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!Quentin declaring Amamda his one true love and casting Beth aside! Boy that curse affected him more
than was thought!Ick :o
2. Seeing Peter B's ghost come back with that stupid noose around his neckThat was a pretty lame storyline!
#.have to add not solving Chris J's problem made me mad too!

jennifer
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: murph on August 03, 2002, 05:19:30 PM: S
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I know the show is not to be taken too seriously but I do wish Dan Curtis would have hired a continuity person.
In 1970 we learn that Roxanne is a vampire and became one in 1840. Soon Barnabus and Julia travel back to 1840 and we learn it was Barnabus that turned Roxanne into a vampire. The only problem is that in 1840 Barnabus was still chained in his coffin so he could not have bitten Roxanne in 1840 so that in 1970 she is still a vampire.

I have loved the show since I was a kid and I still do. I just wish the writers would have done a little more research so the continuity of the stories would have been better.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: VAM on August 03, 2002, 06:11:22 PM: Quote
I know the show is not to be taken too seriously but I do wish Dan Curtis would have hired a continuity person.

I have loved the show since I was a kid and I still do. I just wish the writers would have done a little more research so the continuity of the stories would have been better.

Welcome to the club...
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Bob_the_Bartender on August 03, 2002, 07:19:09 PM: Hey gang,

I could say something extremely puerile about Nicholas Blair's hairstyle or Joe Haskell's alleged "taste" in clothes, but I'd like to think that I'm too mature to stoop to that level.

By the way, Blue Whale Barfly, God Bless You!!! You'll be a saint in Heaven for defending Dark Shadows answer to Mother Theresa, Bathia Mapes. (And, shame on you, VAM!)

However, my vote for the most disturbing moment and/or plot line on DS has to be Barnabas' unconscionable treatment of Maggie and Sam Evans. I can't even begin to list all of the truly lousy things that Mr. B. has done to that family. Suffice it to say, with a friend like Barnabas....

Sincerely,

Bob the Bartender, who, on behalf of the late Mr. Sam Evans, would like to say: "Et tu, Barnabas?"
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: dom on August 03, 2002, 07:36:07 PM: SPOILERS

My two (first time around as a kid, not having seen the complete series) most disturbing moments were:

The shooting death of Julia in 1897 by an unknowing Barnabas as set up by Aristede. At that time I didn't know death was incidental. I thought she was dead and off the show and I was devastated!

The other was the on-screen (and very graphic) molestation of Maggie Evans by John Yeager (I guess that was 1970 PT?). I was both horrified and physically disgusted. I'd never seen anything like that on TV before and to have it happen to innocent Maggie, well it made me sick to my stomach (especially when he started licking his chops). I just didn't see it coming and I would have never expected to.

Dom (Who was a stupid kid and thought verbal bloopers and flies buzzing the studio were done on purpose to create a realism never before seen on TV.)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ShadowsAtlanta on August 03, 2002, 07:45:16 PM: Wow! You folks have thrown some really interesting things into the ring -- several things I'd forgotten about but which are definitely, well, disturbing. :)

I do want to address two things mentioned here, namely Bathia Mapes and Amanda Harris. I must say that I think the moment with Bathia Mapes forgetting (and being fed) her lines is one of the most hilarious moments not just on DS, but on any tv show I've ever seen! I have to cut her some slack for that!! :D

As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? I don't get it... I've heard similar sentiments from several people but have never quite identified what is so objectionable about her behavior and/or demeanor. Thoughts?

Joe :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: RingoCollins on August 03, 2002, 07:49:33 PM: 1) Nicholas Blair's Hairstyle
2) Joe Haskell's alleged 'taste' in clothes
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: kuanyin on August 03, 2002, 08:57:32 PM: Quote
As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why?

She is the female equivalent of Jeffy Clark. At least that is how she strikes me and obviously, quite a few others. Of course, we all have our least favorite actors/characters and fortunately, we don't ALL agree on them!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 03, 2002, 10:37:14 PM: Quote

She is the female equivalent of Jeffy Clark. At least that is how she strikes me and obviously, quite a few others. Of course, we all have our least favorite actors/characters and fortunately, we don't ALL agree on them!

And don't forget HALLIE STOKES!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ROBINV on August 03, 2002, 10:52:18 PM: Potential spoilers. . .

The first time I watched Barnabas and Julia murdering Dr. Woodard, I was only 13 and felt as if I were watching something I shouldn't be. Although the episode was blunted by the use of a totally different actor as Dave Woodard, it was nevertheless extremely disturbing to me. I had already developed a crush on Barnabas, and wondered how I could care for a man who would do such a dreadful thing to a fellow human being.

David's attempt to murder his father by removing the bleeder valve from his car--that a nine-year-old boy would even think of doing such a thing was terribly upsetting to me. Along the same line was David locking Vicki in a deserted room in the East Wing of the house, intending for her to die there. Again, for a child so young, that was quite hard to watch.

Love, Robin
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Raineypark on August 04, 2002, 05:23:35 AM: Willie Loomis is my favorite character.....but I have to admit I always found his relationship to Barnabas Collins deeply disturbing.

When I first watched as a teenager, it was like watching the "slow" kid in class get the crap kicked out of him on the playground by little bastards who thought they were "so tough".

My absolute horror and disbelief that other people actually found Barnabas sexy or attractive was really based on my furious (but futile) desire to protect that tormented kid.

Pretty powerful stuff for 'just a soap opera'!!

Raineypark
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: jennifer on August 04, 2002, 05:29:06 AM: Quote
Wow! You folks have thrown some really interesting things into the ring -- several things I'd forgotten about but which are definitely, well, disturbing. :)

I do want to address two things mentioned here, namely Bathia Mapes and Amanda Harris. I must say that I think the moment with Bathia Mapes forgetting (and being fed) her lines is one of the most hilarious moments not just on DS, but on any tv show I've ever seen! I have to cut her some slack for that!! :D

As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? I don't get it... I've heard similar sentiments from several people but have never quite identified what is so objectionable about her behavior and/or demeanor. Thoughts?

Joe :)

spoilers

Where do you want me to start Joe?
makes me want to know what CDT was drinking the night he dreamed her up!

jennifer
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Luciaphile on August 04, 2002, 07:04:29 AM: In no particular order . . .

1. the Leviathan plot. There's something genuinely creepy watching people drop like flies to worship the one with the soup bowl haircut.
2. the blinding of Sam Evans.
3. What Angelique does to Beth.
4. Barnabas being charming and sympathetic to Maggie all the while determining to use her in a life-threatening experiment
5. Laura. Anything with Laura.

And I have to go with the flow on this one,
6. Amanda Harris

Luciaphil
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: sheenasma on August 04, 2002, 01:53:06 PM: Quote
3. What Angelique does to Beth.

Whch brings us to the most hilarious line ever uttered:

"You'll get over it, dear, everyone does"

Angelique saying this? Angelique who kills everyone in sight and bops in an and out of hell over Barnabas? She can't get over Barnabas, and she she expects someone to forget Quentin??????
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Minja on August 04, 2002, 05:05:01 PM: Quote
Two words: Amanda Harris.

Au Contrair....pales in comparison to the portrayal of Victoria Winters by.....[/color]

BETSY DURKIN!!!![puke][/size]

[shadow=purple,left,300]Always, Minja [vryevl][/shadow]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: kuanyin on August 05, 2002, 02:55:30 AM: SPOILER for 1970 PT...

Oh, I finally thought of my most disturbing DS bit. I KNOW that I won't get the details right, but bear with me. It was in PT I think, when you don't know if Alexis is really Angelique or not. Until the good twin (Alexis) opens the coffin and the bad twin (Angelique) kills her to take her place. It is the only scene in DS that has actually scared me. It still creeps me out to think of it. [sconf]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 05, 2002, 09:33:42 AM: Quote

Au Contrair....pales in comparison to the portrayal of Victoria Winters by.....[/color]

BETSY DURKIN!!!![puke][/size]

[shadow=purple,left,300]Always, Minja [vryevl][/shadow]

OMG! You're right Minja!! LOL!! I forgot all about her!!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 05, 2002, 11:43:03 AM: Quote
SPOILER for 1970 PT... when you don't know if Alexis is really Angelique or not. Until the good twin (Alexis) opens the coffin and the bad twin (Angelique) kills her to take her place.

YES! That scene really scared the you-know-what out of me.

What I really find most disturbing though...was how they killed Carl off in 1897. That was absolutely unnecessary. It didn't make sense. Barnabas didn't have to do that, and Quentin would not have participated. I didn't buy it for a minute. PLUS Carl was so funny and interesting. It's a crying shame.
I read somewhere that the writers killed him off because Karlen was going to be doing a play or something. Does anyone know if that's true?
I mean, they didn't have to kill him for cryin' out loud. They could have just sent him off somewhere.

>:(

-CLC
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Eleanor_Rigby on August 05, 2002, 04:31:42 PM: Many of the scenes listed upset me.

Generally speaking, I was upset by Barnabas' abusive treatment (on some occasions, not always) of Willie, Maggie, Julia, David, Adam, Sandor, Magda, and Quentin. He never bullied the other relatives. Maybe he felt that the other relatives and he were all in the same class and it would have been disrespectful. It was disturbing to see Barnabas lose his courtly air and become a nasty bully.

I did not like the callousness Barnabas and Julia had toward Adam. They saw him as a "thing" and that's all. While others were frightened of Adam, I could see there was a basis for it. The only person who knew Adam's origin and treated him decently was Professor Stokes ... and Carolyn.
Title: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: sheenasma on August 05, 2002, 06:00:40 PM: Quote
As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why?

She sucks

Nancy
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: jennifer on August 05, 2002, 06:12:52 PM: Quote

She sucks

Nancy

ROTFL
SO TRUE

jennifer
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: petofi on August 05, 2002, 07:03:33 PM: As a child of 8 in 1968, any event involving a werewolf attack had the effect of inducing nightmares, but particularly in the case of an out-and-out attack. I remember my older brother waking me from a sleep walk in which I wound up hiding behind my bedroom door, saying, "The werewolf's gonna get me! Help!" After I got over it, it became a joke between us.

As an adult, I find Barnabas' set up of Willie as the maniac responsible for Maggie's kidnapping particularly deplorable. However, the fact that Barn never really makes it up to Willie later, and Willie befriends him anyway, is even more irksome. I guess it's the writers lack of logic and depth, in this latter case, that disturbs me the most.
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: VAM on August 05, 2002, 07:31:14 PM: Quote

She sucks

Nancy

That is unkind...
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Midnite on August 05, 2002, 08:19:09 PM: Quote

That is unkind...

Before passing judgment on each other for our opinions, which I'm not too keen on anyway, let's keep in mind that Amanda Harris is a fictional character.
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Luciaphile on August 05, 2002, 08:20:46 PM: Quote
As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why?

Well, I think Nancy's answer pretty much sums it up, but if you want something more elaborate:

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1. Character comes out of nowhere (hehe, in several ways) and suddenly we're expected to believe that she is Quentin's one true love.

2. God bless Donna McKechnie, but she really doesn't shine in this role.

3. There's that horrible Olivia Corey plot with the hotel to the netherworld and the ill-advised attempt to recreate the Great Beyond.

4. The character is vapid, dull, trite.

5. And as Nancy put it. She sucks.

Luciaphil
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 05, 2002, 11:09:06 PM: Quote

She sucks

Nancy

Short, succinct, well-put. LOL

Oddly enough, I find Olivia Corey much more disturbing than Amanda Harris. Not sure why.

?!?

-CLC
(whose maiden name is McKechnie) 8)
Title: Re: As for Amanda Harris: there is so much animosity towards this character! Why? Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Luciaphile on August 06, 2002, 12:18:36 AM: Quote

Oddly enough, I find Olivia Corey much more disturbing than Amanda Harris. Not sure why.

?!?

Couldn't be all the framed 8x10 glossies of herself that she evidently toted around on her travels and saw fit to decorate her hotel room with, could it? Naaah, of course not 8)

Luciaphil
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Dr. Eric Lang on August 06, 2002, 01:16:26 AM: I agree with Cassandra - there is nothing more disturbing than the shreiking and whining of

Hallie Stokes!

When I was little the most disturbing scene I remember was when the headless body in 1840 sat up from under the leaves where it was hidden. Had nightmares about that. Also, I recall that after the children brought Daphne to life, she was trapped in the dollhouse and Gerard set it on fire. Even at the age of 6 I was able to grasp the concept of her having been dead, brought back to life, and then threatened with death again. I think she even said something like "No Gerard, don't make me die again." Weird what a 6-year old can comprehend.

Others have already covered the more disturbing aspects of the show like Ben Stoke's gruesome death in 1840 and the murder of Dr. Woodard.

I was also disturbed by the scene in which Angelique tortured poor Sarah by sticking pins into the voodoo doll (although this might have had more impact if little Sharon Smythe had been a tad more convincing.)

Connie - I believe that Karlan left the series for Hollywood during the 1897 story. He only came back to it after DC got a 2-picture deal w/MGM and offered Karlen a chance to be in both films under the proviso that he return to NY and the series.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 06, 2002, 04:28:43 AM: Quote

Connie - I believe that Karlan left the series for Hollywood during the 1897 story. He only came back to it after DC got a 2-picture deal w/MGM and offered Karlen a chance to be in both films under the proviso that he return to NY and the series.

Ah - so THAT'S what happened. Thanks for the info. I always find this stuff interesting!

(Doesn't excuse the writers killing Carl though). LOL
I'll never forgive them!

-CLC :'(
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Anubis on August 06, 2002, 07:20:56 AM: For me it was the ghost of Gerard. When I first saw it when I was a kid it scared me so much. Last year when I saw it again it still scared me just as much. The green light he was always in along with that evil look on his face would just give me the shivers.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 06, 2002, 09:10:54 AM: Welcome to the group Anubis! :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ClaudeNorth on August 06, 2002, 10:56:21 AM: SPOILERS.......

Most disturbing moments, serious variety:

1. The implied rape of Buffie Harrington: the harsh realism of rape was out of place on a "fantasy" show like DS.

2. The writers' failure to answer the question of Vicki's parentage. Granted, the series moved away from it's gothic mystery origins, but Vicki was the central character during that first year, and it seems disrespectful of the writers not to give the character a proper send-off.

3. Carolyn's scream as the aged Barnabas prepares to bite her in the Old House basement. I've been known to mute the sound when watching that scene.

Most disturbing moments, humorous variety:

1. Tom Happer as Jeremy Grimes: Granted, he was kinda cute--the Ashton Kutcher of his day--but his acting was wretched. The horrifying moment when he thumped his chest and droned, "Mordecai's son!" is indelibly etched on my brain.

2. That terrible actor who appeared as a widower during the 1995 Flashforward. I seriously wonder if DC didn't walk out of the studio before taping time, grab the first guy he saw, took him into the studio, stood him on the set, and told him to read his lines directly off the TelePrompter.

3. Marilyn Joseph as Lorna Bell. She was married to Chris Pennock at the time, and her appearance on DS serves as a depressing reminder that, in show business, it's all about who you know rather than talent. (This also explains the career of Rita Wilson, but that's a topic for another board...) :)

Regards,

John
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Connie on August 06, 2002, 11:30:02 AM: Quote

2. That terrible actor who appeared as a widower during the 1995 Flashforward. I seriously wonder if DC didn't walk out of the studio before taping time, grab the first guy he saw, took him into the studio, stood him on the set, and told him to read his lines directly off the TelePrompter.

I never saw him. Don't think I have that episode. But has anyone mentioned Joanna Mills???? Ugh! Cringe! Talk about reading off the TelePrompter!!! Plus - she'd even call another character by her own name! It is SO hard to watch and I'm forced to 'cause alot of her scenes are with Quentin. I don't know how he kept from being thrown off by her total ineptitude, but he did.

Quote
3. Marilyn Joseph as Lorna Bell. She was married to Chris Pennock at the time, and her appearance on DS serves as a depressing reminder that, in show business, it's all about who you know rather than talent.

I don't remember her being THAT bad. Was she?? She sort of seemed to fit the character. LOL

But the "Nails On The Chalkboard Award" for me, would definitely have to go to Hallie Stokes. Can't watch her...nope...can't do it.

-CLC
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ShadowsAtlanta on August 06, 2002, 02:15:30 PM: Claude, you raise some excellent points. I agree that the implied rape of Buffie Harrington was out of place. I also totally agree about the loose end of Victoria's parentage.

Regarding the ghost of Gerard, that reminds me...

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... I could never figure out why Gerard's sneering visage appeared in 1995 and 1970 instead of Judah Zachery's. Seems like the possession would have ended upon Gerard's death. Any thoughts?

Joe :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Julian on August 06, 2002, 05:32:57 PM: I've really enjoyed reading the responses on this thread. For me, one of the more disturbing (as well as creepy) things on DS was Ned Stuart's rather obsessive behavior toward his sister Sabrina. There are a few scenes where he tends to handle her a bit too much. Also, when David and Amy are first possessed by Quentin and Beth, they dress up in period costumes and David looks at Amy and makes some remark about how he really "likes" her. That was a really disturbing scene - in fact the whole story about the two children being manipulated by the spirits was.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Anubis on August 07, 2002, 06:57:03 AM: Thanks for the welcome Cassandra. It's about time I joined in. I've been lurking for so long I feel like I know you all. :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Craig_Slocum on August 07, 2002, 07:33:20 AM: Quote
It's about time I joined in. I've been lurking for so long I feel like I know you all. :)

Welcome Anubis, glad you joined in! :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 07, 2002, 09:09:16 AM: Quote
SPOILERS.......

Most disturbing moments, humorous variety:

1. Tom Happer as Jeremy Grimes: Granted, he was kinda cute--the Ashton Kutcher of his day--but his acting was wretched. The horrifying moment when he thumped his chest and droned, "Mordecai's son!" is indelibly etched on my brain.

LOL!! Im still trying to find out just what the heck he was suppose to do on the show? Besides being Mordecai's son, I honestly think they just threw him in there to let the viewers know that HALLIE STOKES is no longer playing the part of a 14 year old!!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Josette on August 07, 2002, 09:52:40 AM: Welcome, Anubis!! :) Glad you decided to "de-lurk"!!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ClaudeNorth on August 08, 2002, 11:11:09 AM: Quote
LOL!! Im still trying to find out just what the heck he was suppose to do on the show? Besides being Mordecai's son, I honestly think they just threw him in there to let the viewers know that HALLIE STOKES is no longer playing the part of a 14 year old!!

LOL! The unfortunate side effect of Jeremy's presence is that it gave Hallie something else to whine about!

Regards,

John
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Misty on August 09, 2002, 04:49:32 AM: ::)This has been most interesting. I guess I'm not easily disturbed because I really never thought of many of these people as annoying. HOWEVER, I was very much angered at the death of Sarah(1) and it drove me crazy when the Chris Jennings "problem was never solved (2). He just disappeared with Amy. (sorry----spoiler) I thought since the Quentin thing seemed to be taken care of-------well, anyway-------I'm disturbed!!
Left hanging, Misty
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Julianka7 on August 10, 2002, 06:58:30 AM: I hated it when Barnabas beat Willie. That one
still gets to me.
And my second pick-1841PT storyline.
Isn't that the one with Bramwell? Yuck!
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ShadowsAtlanta on August 10, 2002, 06:29:05 PM: Julianka, I think 1841PT had its merits, but the one main thing that bothered me was

(possible spoiler)

that there were no characters from the main storyline (that is, 1971RT) to keep us anchored in "our" DS universe. This was the only storyline that pretty much happened in a vacuum, and it felt irrelevant to the overall story. It was an interesting way for the actors to explore different types of characters, though. Which part of that story did you find disturbing?

Joe :)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Julia99 on August 10, 2002, 06:37:43 PM: Quote
For me it was the ghost of Gerard. When I first saw it when I was a kid it scared me so much. Last year when I saw it again it still scared me just as much. The green light he was always in along with that evil look on his face would just give me the shivers.

I agree Gerard was a very menacing figure with his ELVIS-like snarl and green light. Just what did he want .. you had no idea and neither did the people he possessed. .other than killing your best friend and one-true love in the whole world. . little things like that. . .
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Julia99 on August 10, 2002, 06:40:30 PM: Quote
and it drove me crazy when the Chris Jennings "problem was never solved (2). He just disappeared with Amy. Left hanging, Misty

Agreed. .little Amy did she have boys. .are they terrorizing Maine as we speak??
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Misty on August 11, 2002, 05:01:47 AM: ::)Hmmmm----food for thought, Julia99. However, I just came back from a vacation in Maine and the New England area and there was no sign of animal attacks!!!
Of course, the moon wasn't full!!!

Ever vigilant, Misty
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ms._hoffman on August 11, 2002, 10:09:27 PM: It was disturbing when Lt. Forbes contemplated doing harm to Millicents brother.

Another disturbing story when when Rev. Trask when married to Judith tried to drive her insane; also when Lt. Forbes tried to drive Millicent insane.
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: scout75 on August 16, 2002, 07:02:31 AM: Usually the vampire scenes are so stagey and badly done...

BUT--

In at the end of Thursday's (8/15) first episode, it totally looked scary AND real when Angelique took a bite outta Barnabas!

Yikes!
[scrdy][shkdb][undg]
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: ClaudeNorth on August 16, 2002, 07:23:02 AM: Another disturbing moment that comes to mind occurred during the period when David was in the throes of his fear of Barnabas. I remember Burke trying to comfort David, and then wondering just what sort of monster Barnabas was to cause such a reaction in David. I remember getting a definite sense that the subtext of the scene was that Burke suspected Barnabas of being a child molester. It was subtle and not lingered on, but I found it rather disturbing nonetheless.

Regards,

John
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: Cassandra on August 16, 2002, 11:21:53 AM: Quote
Another disturbing story when when Rev. Trask when married to Judith tried to drive her insane;

I totally agree. And what got me was that he was "suppose" to be a man of the cloth.

SPOILER......SPOILER......SPOILER........SPOILER..........

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I was so happy when Judith finally got her revenge for this in the end. ;)
Title: Re: Most disturbing DS moments
Post by: IluvBarnabas on May 03, 2008, 08:25:33 PM: Quote from: Craig_Slocum on August 03, 2002, 07:18:56 AM
The first most disturbing event on Dark Shadows was when Vicki killed Noah Gifford, >:(

[spoiler]

Right, Vicki should have let Noah live and and let him strangle Daniel to death and therefore let generations of Collins cease to exist.

I don't see Noah's death disturbing at all, it was a necessary evil for the survival of every single Collins yet to come.

Tripwire questions Barnabas wanting to help Chris Jennings, someone he barely knew...what's wrong with that? Chris was under a curse and Barnabas himself knew all too well what it was like living under a curse. He felt sympathy for Chris' plight. I admire Barnabas for this and wanting to help Chris.

As for disturbing moments, I concur that the murders of Dr. Woodard and Carl were very disturbing. Carl a bit more considering he was a blood relative of Barnabas'.

I mean, when Vicki shot Noah, it was to save Daniel's life...she had no choice. I believe and still do Barnabas could have found another, less harsh way to deal with Carl. [/spoiler]