DARK SHADOWS FORUMS
General Discussions => Current Talk Archive => Current Talk '24 I => Current Talk '10 I => Topic started by: The Doctor and K9 on March 07, 2010, 06:38:38 PM
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This has puzzled me for years. As I'm sure everyone knows the DS eps used to have that announcent that DS is a DCP. It stops during early Barnabas. I was at a Fest and I'm pretty sure I heard a clip where that announcement came on after a Leviathan episode! Does anyone remember if this was done on air during the original run? If so, why was it on the tapes for the first year or so and not later? It's a very trivial question, but I've wondered about it for a long time.
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I think you may be right about that, I sort of remember something like that happening. The DCP logo was also changed in a few episodes around that time.
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And when the ABC announcer stopped doing the DCP spiel in the early episodes, Hall and Moltke picked it up for a bit, but that didn't last long.
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This doesn't answer the question about how I could have heard that announcement over in an episode from late 69 or 70. I wonder if they continued it, but did not record it on the master in favor of having it go out live on the broadcast date. I'm certain I heard it at a festival, but it came from what looked like a BW kinescope instead of one of the color masters. I could be wrong, which is why I'm checking to see if anyone has similar memories. All my old audio tapes are not of any help. They don't have the end credit music.
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i think part of this question is covered in 1 of the kls books maybe the almanac but im not positive. the reason for the end announcement being stopped is because 1 of the station breaks was eliminated at some point and they didnt need the announcer to say "dark shadows will return in a moment" or "dark shadows is brought to you by" so i guess they fired the guy. the other part of your question where the dcp spiel is heard on a 69 or 70 episode, i dont know the answer to that.
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After what Joe said, I'm beginning to think I heard it wrong at the Fest. Memory is a tricky thing.
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I'm not sure about whether or not the DCP announcement was ever heard at the end of a Leviathans ep. I don't recall ever hearing it - but I haven't watched Leviathans in years. However, one thing that I do know is that they didn't continue it by doing it live.
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Which was exactly my point about Hall and Moltke filling in. The ABC announcer no longer did it live, so if you heard his voice, I doubt it was there originally. Since he had stopped in 1967, I can't imagine the announcement being picked up later on especially just for one episode. Maybe they added it just for fun at the fest, but idk.
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I have noticed something really weird. The announcement happens quite frequently on episodes that are in kinetoscope format! What could this possibly mean? I heard it in 1795 and now I just heard it in 1969 - Episode 683. What could this mean?
Was the end title music redone on the regular color episodes at some point, thus eliminating the DCP announcement? There wouldn't be a point to redoing the music on the kinetoscope episodes due to quality clash, though I think I recall one instance in which the music was clearly restored. This is really intriguing. Just thought I'd bring it up.
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As I stated in an earlier post, I was pretty certain I heard that announcement over a Leviathan episde (you could see the altar). I'm pretty sure the clip was in BW.
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We just heard it in PT episode #1021.
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That's very interesting. And I just checked my VHS tape from the '97 Sci-Fi broadcast of Ep #1021, and it's on there too, which isn't always the case. (Some of the music cues had been changed for broadcast on Sci-Fi. [mady])
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So I am thinking that the announcement was always there on the original broadcasts. Somewhere along the lines, the audio was redone for the end titles and the announcement was lost. This is really weird, considering that the announcement is present in all of the early episodes. I don't understand the logic behind this, but this is one of the few conclusions that we can draw about this interesting phenomenon.
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The sound during the closing credits of #1021 was strange too, distorted or noisy or something. I figure that someone pressed a wrong button or something, though it seems odd that a bit of tape would have stayed poised and ready to be played that they'd abandoned years earlier.
No one would have gone through episodes after broadcast and eliminated that announcement... I'm not even sure it would have been possible. Anyway, no one would have had any reason to bother. I think I'd remember if during my childhood, that announcement had always been there. I'm sure it wasn't.
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1 reason for rerecording the end music credits would be to cover up the abc announcer promoting other abc shows but i agree with the previous poster because i remember watching the show originally (although not on a regular basis) but never hearing that "dark shadows is a dan curtis production" in later episodes.
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No one would have gone through episodes after broadcast and eliminated that announcement... I'm not even sure it would have been possible. Anyway, no one would have had any reason to bother.
Tell that to Jim Pierson. He's made all sorts of changes to the eps through the years - not all of them incidental or at all necessary in many fans' opinions...
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Were the "Coming Up" announcements burned into the Kinetoscope versions of the episodes?
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since the kinescopes were recorded as the show was airing, yes the "coming up next on abc" announcements were recorded onto the kinescopes.
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Perhaps it's best to establish here what a kinescope is. I think a kinescope consists of someone simply pointing a camera at a television or TV monitor, and recording. Therefore, anything broadcast is what is on the kinescope. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
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So, if the kinescope captured everything that was broadcast originally, then it is possible that the audio at the end of the kinescope episodes was dubbed over in the editing process. Whoever did this could have used the audio from an early kinescope episode that didn't have announcements, but included the DCP tag. Perhaps the same audio plays at the end of every kinescope episode, which is why we hear the DCP announcement. I'm just throwing out possibilities.
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Perhaps it's best to establish here what a kinescope is. I think a kinescope consists of someone simply pointing a camera at a television or TV monitor, and recording. Therefore, anything broadcast is what is on the kinescope. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
A kinescope is the process of filming a TV show onto16mm film from a video moniter. I believe the reason they did this was to be able to air a program taped in New York at 4:00 PM and show it at 1:00 PM in California. Or 2:00 PM or whatever the time zone demanded. This process has allowed many old time TV shows to have been saved. It's on film, baby!
What is with this fascination with the announcer guy? Does anyone even know who he was???
IMHO, the announcer was a local New York guy who announced upcoming programming or what not. Who knows why his voice is heard on some episodes and not others? I'm guessing it has to do with whoever put the DS tapes together in the first place. I mean, lookit. Why do some episodes run all the credits and others don't? Some episodes I can run out in the kitchen and make a cheese sandwich waiting for the credits to run. Other episodes simply end with, "This has been a Dan Curtis production" and I am glued to my seat waiting for the next episode to begin.
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in the old old days before videotape was even invented was when they used the kinescopes for the west coast because everything then was live on the east coast. they continued to use kinescopes after videotape was invented for the armed forces or for the few stations that would show dark shadows the next day. it was easier and cheaper to send a 16mm film than a 2inch wide videotape. i think the abc announcer is named in 1 of kls books.
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I thought that kinescopes were never recorded officially for broadcast but for some other perhaps technical purpose. That's based on zero DS knowledge but just what I've heard about kinescope. Anyway, Janet, I think they jetissoned the end credits with some episodes just because they ran out of time.
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Bob Lloyd
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IMHO, the announcer was a local New York guy who announced upcoming programming or what not.
Lloyd's voiceover promos could be heard on ABC-TV through the early 70s: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoBMulTGszc and he became a voiceover agent in New York (one of only a handful back then), and in 1975 switched to voice casting, earning the nickname The Voicecaster and starting the company Voicecasters (http://www.voicecaster.com), which to date is the largest voice casting studio in the country.
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Wicked cool info. And in the words of Warner Oland, "Thank you so much".
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Tell that to Jim Pierson. He's made all sorts of changes to the eps through the years - not all of them incidental or at all necessary in many fans' opinions...
Which brings to mind, Jim Pierson-MPI all in one are the same, right? How did he originally come to have the DS tapes to begin with? If he got them from World Vision(?) what changes did he make or were these changes done by WV? Just wondering how it all came about if anyone knows.
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he got the tapes because he worked for dan curtis productions. but how did he get the job at dan curtis productions? i have a theory about that but i cant post it here because it will surely be removed. anyone who wants to know can contact me directly.
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Not to promote Jim Pierson's bandwagon, but in addition to DS, he has done a lot to get other long-time TV shows on DVD through MPI, sush as "The Doris Day Show," "The Jackie Gleason Show" (aka "The Color Honeymooners) and 'Here's Lucy." I'm very certain that "Here's Lucy" has been released with the permission of Lucie Arnaz and Desi Arnaz, Jr., who control the rights to use their parents' images and TV programs. Anyway, I know Jim Pierson has been criticized for many years by some DS fans for his actions with regards to DS, but apparently Dan Curtis approved his involvement in protecting Curtis' programs. (And NO, I am not Jim Pierson, nor do I know him--but maybe we would not have DS on VHS (from 1989 on) or DVD (from the mid- 2000s) without his championing the show. Just my opinion, for what it is worth. Brian
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i also read in a book about THE HOLLYWOOD SQUARES that jim is also responsible for finding many old/lost hollywood squares episodes and that he found those while searching for lost DS episodes.
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Unfortunately, Pierson has been known to be his own worst enemy. Though those are situations that are certainly OT for this topic. But, sadly, there are topics on the forum with illustrative examples. And that's about all that should be said here...